Neocon Bullshit - For ETS's Consideration (819 hits)
Category: Politics -> IraqRating: 0.31 on 44 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by MaesterMeat (View user info) at 2007-06-08 18:25:47 EDT
If the Neocons pulled off 9/11, how come they didn't forge the WMD's in Iraq to have the "sheep" Americans buy the war?
Seems pretty easy that they could shut up weapons inspectors to plant some WMD's.
While I hate those dumbass, self-righteous conservative pundits I still think they could have done a better job selling us the Iraq war, especially if they pulled off 9/11 (I don't think they did, just going off the evidence from the truthers.) They did fake the documents to invade Iraq, so what's stopping them from planting evidence?
On another note, it seems kind of stupid that they would go all the way to Iraq to engage enemies that vaguely resemble terrorists and leave the border wide open. I was out there when it all kicked off back in '03; it was a joke, there is no way those guys were a threat.
The hatred that has built in respone to our little occupation (I travel around the world regularly, so I get diverse opinion that is intriguing to say the least) is a lot worse than any kind of would-be threat from Iraq, at least from my own observations.
I posted this back when the war started, thought you might like to read it:
Link whore: http://www.ubersite.com/m/5774
Anyone else want to get in on this discussion? If not, -2 and be on your way. That is all.
User Reviews
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-13 23:15:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
turns out you're a fucking moron, eh?
http://www.ubersite.com/m/109213#2441818
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-11 16:12:50 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Meat is right, but this whole mess can also be traced back to the stolen election in 2000. Americans did get it right then by the slimmest of majorities, but then did nothing when the powers that be robbed us of the right result.
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Yep, but he got re-elected in 2004 when the country was too damn scared to have anything other than a stick 'em up cowboy running the show, and look at where that has gotten us. That guy is the poster child for stubborness, I really wonder if he thinks he's actually right or if he's doing it just to fuck with our heads.
He does read the Bible everynight, so he can't be a bad guy. /sarcasm
Submitted by FilledwithHate (user info) at 2007-06-11 15:30:07 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Meat is right, but this whole mess can also be traced back to the stolen election in 2000. Americans did get it right then by the slimmest of majorities, but then did nothing when the powers that be robbed us of the right result.
That said we are fat, arrogant, lazy slobs and deserve the day of reckoning coming our way.
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Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:52:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul's got good points about Americans not owning up to this cluster fuck, but people still were lied to.
The nationalism came from a thinly veiled guise that we were infact going to fight the same enemy in Iraq that got us on 9/11.
It is a two party ignorance of the Middle East and Muslims in general. By categorizing their religion we were able to sell them all off as the same: terrorists hell bent on killing us.
We have every right to be ignorant of things but it sure didn't fucking help.
But I agree Caul, it's every bit our fault as it is the politicans.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-11 14:51:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
True ETS, but why create a whistle-blowing fuck storm. Seems quite unecessary for a group of people that are evil to just say "fuck it" on the key issue of invasion.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-11 14:40:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Pretty good hidden. You still in the military?
Submitted by hidden101 (user info) at 2007-06-10 13:43:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 19:52:13 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hmmm. Maybe they believe that most Americans actually believe that our country was just skipping around picking sand daisies in the Middle East and Muslims just attacked us while we were handing out peanut brittle for no reason.
I've always believed people needed to get the fuckin' halo off their heads, seriously. If it was the other way around and Muslims were trying to milk oil out of the Gulf of Mexico the same right wing neocons would be acting like the fucking terrorists that they are.
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truer words were never spoken.
how's it going, Derek? i'm in Afghanistan right now. this place is way better than Iraq. i fucking hated Baghdad. it makes this place look like paradise.
Submitted by TheUniter (user info) at 2007-06-10 12:06:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2007-06-09 22:35:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Stop for a moment. What you're saying is common sense; a force that ETS, like most conspiracy theorists, is immune to. If you want to nail him on this debate, you'll have to prove that the leprechaun vampires, NOT the neocons, plotted 9/11.
Submitted by d_prime (user info) at 2007-06-09 20:27:03 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
I'm tired of hearing the same foreign policy opinion over and over again. Say something new, or go find someone who already said it and merely mumble that you agree.
Submitted by beeltea (user info) at 2007-06-09 05:43:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by thorpe (user info) at 2007-06-09 03:20:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
The fact that it was ever worth it to you is something to marvel at.
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yeah? Well your mother certainly "marvelled" at it... if you know what I mean...
and I think you do.
Submitted by thorpe (user info) at 2007-06-09 03:20:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
The fact that it was ever worth it to you is something to marvel at.
Submitted by electrictoothsyndrome (user info) at 2007-06-08 23:46:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
The weapons inspector was from the UN, perhaps he was a bit more incorruptible and conscientious in that regard. Besides...why should they try to plant WMD? It's not like anybody really cared they weren't there. They just claimed they'd been taken out to Syria or Iran, or that they were on trucks, or they're still buried somewhere out in the sand. At this point, though, nobody cares. Just like the hundreds of questions surrounding 9/11, no one cares.
Also, getting into Iraq was the only objective the WMD story was there to serve, that service was accomplished the minute "shock and awe" started. You're talking about evil fucks who not only don't give a rat's ass what the American people think, but they're so smug about what they do, they don't think the American people CAN think, or will do anything about it even if they can...and you know something...THEY'RE FUCKING RIGHT! I hate to say it, but we've proven them right.
You can ask questions like this that seem to cast doubt on our government playing a part in 9/11, but for every question like this you come up with, I can give you 100 more that point to 9/11 being an inside job, or at LEAST our government knowing about it beforehand and doing nothing.
I'm not gonna argue it anymore. Not on this website, anyway. It's no longer worth it to me.
Submitted by Jeanneee (user info) at 2007-06-08 23:16:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Here's my 2 cents:
I was against this war from the beginning, especially how it was sold as some kind of retribution for 9/11. That never made the slightest bit of sense to me.
I never gave a shit about Saddam Hussein either. I always thought we learned our lesson in Desert Storm - we went in, burned some shit, and everything stayed pretty much the same. What did the administration think they were going to accomplish the second time around?
But now I don't even feel vindicated that I was right about it being a terrible idea, because it still happened, and now there is no real way to get out without making things exponentially worse.
So yeah... even though I relish being right (since it happens so rarely), I will never be able take any satisfaction in it. This whole situation is fucked and the world is going to be paying for it in spades for generations to come.
In short, I'm at a total loss. Not that this is anything new for me.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:32:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:10:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Naw rob, if you deny that right you deny freedom.
Freedom is a fucking crazy thing, it allows dumbasses to be dumbasses.
That sucks, but if you force people to educate themselves (which is not 'freedom')
you take away their given right to be retarded.
Basically, I agree with you but sadly we can only circle jerk in hopes of halting ignorance.
I'd love to debate this more but I'm off work finally (I'm on hawaiian time, hence the lateness no doubt where you are).
I'll have a surf this weekend in tribute of the ongoing "fuck you! Naw, fuck you!" session between you Uber dudes.
Later.
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Interesting take.
I suggest there is precedent. Ignorance of the law does not forgive individual accountability if a person breaks an established law.
The notion of 'freedom' should not protect stupid people any more than it protects people who litter, or speed.
After all, those are intrinsically 'stupid' things to do anyway. We, as a society, have already determined such things to be 'illegal' for the common good.
I might suggest that we need to expand on that - sure it will cost an unimaginable amount of money and require an incomprehensible amount of additional 'law enforcement' - but we are talking about a fundamental shift in the way 'we' as a people perceive our own reality.
Of course - considering how many fucking stupid people there are out there in this world doing destructive shitty things every single day - I am of the belief that 'cost' would prove to be insignificant in comparison to the ultimate benefits that would come as a result of pro-actively doing something about how dumb we are.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:10:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Naw rob, if you deny that right you deny freedom.
Freedom is a fucking crazy thing, it allows dumbasses to be dumbasses.
That sucks, but if you force people to educate themselves (which is not 'freedom')
you take away their given right to be retarded.
Basically, I agree with you but sadly we can only circle jerk in hopes of halting ignorance.
I'd love to debate this more but I'm off work finally (I'm on hawaiian time, hence the lateness no doubt where you are).
I'll have a surf this weekend in tribute of the ongoing "fuck you! Naw, fuck you!" session between you Uber dudes.
Later.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:07:25 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
hmmm... that might even be Society's 'encouragement' instead of tolerance - depending on how deeply you buy into the idea that we are ultimately being lead.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:07:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:04:09 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Ignorance shouldn't be a right - it should be a crime.
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lmao...that's why you naively parrot the same exact stereotypes about your fellow countrymen that are found on extremist canadian websites.
jail yourself, bitch!
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:04:09 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:52:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
We have every right to be ignorant of things
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I have to disagree with you on that one. Society's tolerance for rampant ignorance is what leads to Cluster-fucks like Iraq.
Ignorance shouldn't be a right - it should be a crime.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 21:02:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
politicians always lie or distort, on pretty much EVERY issue. that's how you get elected.
in a business as serious as war, it would've been wise not to rush and ask more questions.
the government only enable the people's will, that,s all i'm saying.
i must go.
bonne fin de semaine :)
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:52:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul's got good points about Americans not owning up to this cluster fuck, but people still were lied to.
The nationalism came from a thinly veiled guise that we were infact going to fight the same enemy in Iraq that got us on 9/11.
It is a two party ignorance of the Middle East and Muslims in general. By categorizing their religion we were able to sell them all off as the same: terrorists hell bent on killing us.
We have every right to be ignorant of things but it sure didn't fucking help.
But I agree Caul, it's every bit our fault as it is the politicans.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:51:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:42:09 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul, come on man. Basically the whole thing was
"Shit! Saddam got a gun, get that bitch, he gonna shoot sooner or later so let him have it! He been mistreatin' his kids too, we need to straighten that shit out!"
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i know that. but that was just the trigger of an already gung ho hungry for war populace.
i remember in the built up to the war. violence was so pretty. every websites had beautiful graphic work of missiles, airforce, soldiers gear, armor units, statistical comparisons with iraq and what the fuck not. it was like reading si.com. the media follows public opinion and it only provided a product that people wanted.
people get the government and policies they deserve.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:45:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
according to rob_berg i'm insane, when he's the one so deeply involved with this website that he needs to write posts about it.
he needs to force himself off of it and he gets worked up while i'm here, working a little, calmly listening to drinking in LA from bran van 3000, waiting for my gf to come and get me so we go to a lounge bar.
rob is probably at the edge of his seat, biting his nail and hugging his comp, putting his nutsack on the powersupply fan and picturing its the warm breeze of uberusers breath.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:42:09 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul, come on man. Basically the whole thing was
"Shit! Saddam got a gun, get that bitch, he gonna shoot sooner or later so let him have it! He been mistreatin' his kids too, we need to straighten that shit out!"
Then after the cop shot him in "defense" we realized Saddam was carrying a pea shooter and now we got the fuckin' kids, their neighbors, and their cousin's brothers all over the damn place.
Yep, we got the kids now, and we can't just throw 'em out. That'll go against the whole halo "freedom" thing, now wouldn't it?
Shit, I can't tell if I am arguing with you are defending you now.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:40:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:30:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul,
I don't know dude, you certainly aren't refrencing my American ass.
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i said collectively. and yes, with 80%+ support you can say that. that's a majority i'm not sure roosevelt had after pearl harbor.
instead of blaming WMDz and Bush, i would hope that american would relect collectively and individually on why they made this absurdity happened. you know...accountability.
blaming a handful of elected douches is a cop out.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:38:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Oh, and I like the way you think as well - especially your appreciation for civilized discourse.
Don't tell the insane French Canadian about that though - he hates it when I make e-friends with people.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:35:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:26:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
rob -
Are you suggesting that possibly that the no WMD's issue was part of the plot to piss of the fanatics more so that the military stays, thus continuing the need for us to stay there so we can 'protect' both Iraqis and ourselves, in effect also keeping the oil companies well furnished and our dominance in the Middle East stable?
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I think that is absolutely a possibility.
Also - another thing that has recently come to light on an economic level is the suddenly lucrative prospect of mining the fuck out of northern Alberta due to oil prices being so astronomically high as compared to the onset of this war. The extraction of oil from the 'tar sands' did not make any economic sense when oil was trading around $20/barrel - but at present levels it is highly lucrative to do such a thing.
We are all distracted with the shit-show going on in the middle east, while the multi-national companies drool over the trillions of barrels that are suddenly accessible.
Of course, its just a theory - but you have to admit it makes a certain amount of sense in the right context.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:34:34 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
you talk as if the WMD pretext was the central point.
it's as if you said that the assassination of Ferdinand was the only reason of WWI when it just what triggered overly nationalistic and optimistic nations to butcher each others.
the fact of the matter is that Americans collectivly WANTED a war, badly.
now they got it. :-)
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:31:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Why the fuck hasn't ETS written yet...
come on dude back me up fucker!
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:30:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul,
I don't know dude, you certainly aren't refrencing my American ass. I was appalled at how we treated France and I thought the opposite, even if Hussein did have rock hard weapons in his pants.
Most Americans truly believed that dude was a threat (so they saw no "razorblades" because of their own willful arrogance and ignorance.) I was there man, I saw how we tore that place up in mere days. I say again, he wasn't any kind of threat, and the real shit didn't start popping off until the fanatics began to pour in.
The idea was "hit 'em before they hit us".
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:26:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
rob -
Are you suggesting that possibly that the no WMD's issue was part of the plot to piss of the fanatics more so that the military stays, thus continuing the need for us to stay there so we can 'protect' both Iraqis and ourselves, in effect also keeping the oil companies well furnished and our dominance in the Middle East stable?
On another note, I like the way you think. I won't suck you off or anything though (not that you'd want that, I have gap teeth - or is that a good thing?)
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:25:25 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
... not that being blissfully ignorant is all that bad.
We have become rather adept at creating wonderful distractions.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:24:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:05:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul, your logic dictates that if I find a razor blade in my burger then tough shit, I was all about eating that burger before I bit down into it.
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the entire world was laughing at the WMD argument. and everybody knew this war would drag on.
your metaphor doesn't work.
let me correct it: there was a big fat burger made out of razor blades, sticking it out from all sides but you collectivly chose to ignore it and thought "mmmmm, i want it...it looks so kewl!"
the war wasn't sold because you were lied to. the WMD pretext had little to do with it. the war sold well because of nationalism and the estetical side of violence that the media showed you. the population was hungry for blood and action. the built up was like watching sports fans. but when people started dying for real, when it got brutal, it wasn't funny anymore. all the drum banging and shit talking and images of clean beautiful tank firing up the night disappeared and changed into blaming Bush.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:19:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
You are assuming you even know what the 'plot' is.
Suffice it to say there is a lot that goes on in this crazy fucked up world that most people are happy to ignore. I find it laughable that people resist the idea that highly organized group of wealthy, connected, ambitious, evil motherfuckers are doing what they can to manipulate a largely distracted and/or viciously exploited global population.
Of course these people exist. Of course they have a selfish agenda. Of course we have no fucking clue what it is and are largely content on remaining oblivious so long as it doesn't impact our blissfully ignorant little lives.
SO - until WE decide to embrace/create a society that is built on transparency and DEMANDS accountability we will continue to wallow in this chaotic bullshit existence of secrecy, lies and conspiracy.
n' stuff.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:10:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
i'm not really worked up.
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you sure as hell fooled me
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:08:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
You can read my posts from 2003 and see that I wasn't all gung ho and elitist. Not that'd I recommend doing such a thing.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:05:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I wasn't all for warring it up.
Somebody said the dude had weapons, and we bought that shit.
Caul, your logic dictates that if I find a razor blade in my burger then tough shit, I was all about eating that burger before I bit down into it.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 20:01:24 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
seriously...it's annoying.
4 years ago americans were all gung ho. opposing countries were surrendering monkeys and back-stabbers and whatnot.
you try to twist everybody's arm to join your little crusade and polluted our headlines with all that tough talk.
now you got your war and all we hear is how you were lied to by Bush, as if he is some kind of all-powerful malicious genie that tricked your poor poor guys.
have some accountability and shut. the. fuck. up.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 19:55:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
80%+ of americans wanted that war before it started.
now that you got it, could you please stop breaking our balls with all that opposition and stop putting the blame on a handful of neo-cons when in reality congress (your elected leaders) enabled this retarded conflict.
americans wanted a war. they got it.
deal with your problems and stfu already.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 19:52:13 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hmmm. Maybe they believe that most Americans actually believe that our country was just skipping around picking sand daisies in the Middle East and Muslims just attacked us while we were handing out peanut brittle for no reason.
I've always believed people needed to get the fuckin' halo off their heads, seriously. If it was the other way around and Muslims were trying to milk oil out of the Gulf of Mexico the same right wing neocons would be acting like the fucking terrorists that they are.
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 19:39:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I know that, but why leave the WMD gap wide open for people to start whistle-blowing on it? If they can sell the fake documents to start the war, why leave that part unchecked?
Seems kind of contradictory to an elite plot.
Only reasons I guess...
1. They went through temporary retardation and left the WMD evidence out of the picture (quite a big fucking hole in the conspiracy operation.)
2. They actually believed the fake evidence urging invasion.
3. They knew the evidence was fake but assumed they'd find WMD's anyway, or something that would make the war just and not have to resort to the hypocritical crutch of "freedom".
4. They just don't give a shit and assume Americans would be cool with fucking stuff up as long as they are secure (Which would add to their retardation since we are less secure.)
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2007-06-08 19:19:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
"they could have done a better job selling us the Iraq war"
um... 'you' bought it.
Seems seems to me like they did a pretty good job. (And by good, I mean fucking tragic.)
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 18:49:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
i'm not really worked up.
american politics are largely inconsequential to me. i just wished the US went easy on GMOs so i don't have to eat ridiculously oversized fruits that look like aliens. that's about how i care about US politics. all that warring and muslim raping makes nice youtube footage :-P
i'm just trying to instill some perspective in ETS deranged little head on this boring friday night.
i need to dumb by gf and get back to the nightlife :-)
Submitted by MaesterMeat (user info) at 2007-06-08 18:43:55 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
haha. I think you're getting a little to worked up with ETS, you are kind of giving him credibility by fueling the fire.
To me, its awesome seeing you guys go tit-for-tat. I just keep my head nice and warm up my ass.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2007-06-08 18:41:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
brad thinks its normal to harass people and follow them at their private homes. he even considers murdering people for not admitting to his fantasy stories.
maybe we ought to return the favor.
someone find his personal info, post it on ubersite and follow him to his appartment. if he doesn't admit that he's a paedophile or something incriminating, harrass him...or better yet, assault him.