Dark Knight - Does No One Else See This? **Spoiler Alert** (993 hits)
Category: Movies & TVRating: -0.08 on 32 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by Dalai Queso (View user info) at 2008-07-19 19:00:07 EDT
Dark Knight "kicks ass", in the vernacular of many who would favor the movie.
It aims with deadly accuracy at it's target audience, a specific generation of people.
It delivers right over the heads of most viewers, and straight into their minds.
"Sometimes the truth isn't good enough. People deserve to have their faith rewarded," The Batman closes the movie with.
I will warn you readers who haven't seen this movie yet, this may spoil it to some degree.
Batman's identity is unknown to the public, and the film makes it clear that this is for the good of everyone involved. Secrets and lies are necessary for everyone to be safe, and for everyone to be happy.
Batman, as we the educated viewers know, is a true hero. However, for the good of all, he takes the fall. He fights for the weak as the vigilante. His heroic efforts require him to go above the law, but we needn't worry. In the words of The Joker, "You're incorruptible," aren't you, faceless hero? This hero needs no accountability.
We truly need such a protector, according to this film. The enemy is getting stronger, smarter, and vastly more wicked. The bad guy isn't after your valuables, he isn't after anything you can surrender to him but your life. And he is mind-blowingly clever in how he goes about taking it from you.
The movie makes gruesomely clear how sick and violent the criminals mind is. It introduces to you several more forms of twisted torment that a human can suffer. The film effectively fills your mind with mental images of these vile tortures without displaying graphic violence beyond what the general public is desensitized to.
This bad guy is scary. This bad guy is more than traditional authorities can handle. Of course, according to the film, only one can stop this evil.
The lone hero isn't invincible, however. Sure, he's highly trained, inconcievably well equipped, and inhumanly unstoppable, but he needs your cooperation. The hero needs to be above the law to carry out his justice.
Batman is so far above the law, in fact, that he takes on the whole SWAT team to save the innocent people the SWAT team would otherwise inadvertantly harm. Batman's trouncing of traditional authority saves the day.
At one point, Batman utilizes a technology that turns a cell phone into a spy device, giving him clear view of a specific area. As the desperation of the situation intensifies, Batman developes a system that turns all cell phones into the very same spy device, giving him unlimited access to every persons whereabouts and actions.
It is made clear to the audience that this is indeed a complete invasion of privacy, and the users of this system are very much aware of the unlimited potential for abuse. The audience is reassured, however, that though the hero chooses to utilize this system, the system will be shut down for good after this one time use. Just this once.
A variety a small detonations on the machine at the end of the movie signify that the system was indeed taken offline. No thought is given to how easily the system could be restored.
In the end, the man everyone had placed their hope in fell. He fell far, and he fell hard. The man that was supposed to save the city in a righteous and law abiding manner was brought down.
Not just broken, this face of justice became as vile as the those he was trying to put away, or more so.
Lies for safety become lies for hope. The moral failure of the face of justice "must be" hidden from the public, as the hope of the public is more important than the truth. This time. Only this time.
The movie reiterates this message several times, and with shockingly minimal subtlety; no one is safe from a vicious predator. Only one man granted exceptional power and resources can save us.
We just need to trust him.
User Reviews
Submitted by Acarnis (user info) at 2008-07-22 10:57:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Let me clarify the "tragic hero" paragraph. The coverup at the end of movie does not, at least in the director's eyes, make Batman a tragic hero. Being perceived an anti-hero by the public is not the same as actually being one. For example, Spiderman is not an anti-hero, but he's perceived as one by the public. The people making the movie still have Batman as "incorruptible" since he never crossed his only tenet, of actually executing someone. The makers of the movie emphasize the difference of Two-Face and Batman almost solely on this execution tenet.
Consider someone like me who finds that having only one moral in a moral code as rubbish. I find that Batman crossed the line to anti-hero, much like Two-Face, far before the end of the movie. If you want to say that Batman became a tragic hero at a point earlier in the movie, then you'd be agreeing with me. Under my moral code, Batman was already corrupted by the time Joker called him "incorruptible."
trax, the movie was actually pretty good. Granted, the hero/villian/politics mixture was lamer than before, but it was still enjoyable.
Submitted by traxadron (user info) at 2008-07-22 09:42:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Movie SUCKED. Sucked bad. No direction, some lame mixture of politics/hero/good guy/vilan.
GARBAGE. Days of Hollywood are done, been done for a while.
Get over it it you losers.
Submitted by Acarnis (user info) at 2008-07-22 00:10:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2008-07-21 00:07:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
morality IS relative. there are actually only a few tenets that almost all cultures hold, usually being along the lines murder and theft. everything from pig fucking to not eating meat on a friday is subjective to the context of the culture/religion handing out the rules and punishments.
---------
As illustrated in my prior comments, different regions and groups of ideologies of this very country have different morals. The more liberal parts tend to take moral relativism to a new level. Not only are morals up to the individual, but they can actually change based on the situation. There is little black & white, even within the society.
As someone that is more libertarian-minded, it appears ridiculous to me that Batman breaks so many laws except for his own sole arbitrary tenet. As long as he doesn't cross that last line, he is "incorruptible." --But some of us watching this movie do not share the same moral code, as you just agreed. Some of us find the new vigilante Batman as already an anti-hero, far before the end of the movie.
And no...I don't ever remember Batman as an anti-hero in previous comics and cartoons. The closest I remember seeing that was during the Bane saga in the comics--Bruce Wayne's replacement became incredibly abusive with his power. But that wasn't even Bruce Wayne. Sure, there may be a populace that hates Batman, but this movie ends with the entire Gotham City hating him.
I did not know you meant "tragic hero" when you said "flawed hero." However, you may not be quite understanding the original poster. Batman is not a good example of a tragic hero. He's not dead nor close to it, even with his newfound vigilante status. Harvey Dent would be a good example of a tragic hero.
I don't see a political agenda in this, nor did I ever even hint at one other than mentioning some political words. I was comparing moralities held by liberals and conservatives. Most movies have a liberal moral code, actually; and most people don't realize it. Even though a bit of entertainment could probably sway an election, this movie is not going to. As a libertarian disappointed with the current administration, I wouldn't mind Obama being elected, either. You assuming that I see a political agenda in this could also mean a few things about you.
Submitted by Jeanneee (user info) at 2008-07-21 10:06:19 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I'll admit, your post didn't make too much sense to me. But I'm still going to see the movie. Apparently it's required by law or something.
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2008-07-21 00:23:24 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
or even better you can make him an anti-hero.
IT'S JUST A MOVIE!!!!!
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2008-07-21 00:07:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Acarnis (user info) at 2008-07-20 10:42:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
whiskey_jack, Batman reaches new outlaw status far earlier than the end of the movie. By focusing on the coverup (the "low point") at the end, you're not only missing the point; but you're also condoning all his previous infractions. If the end wasn't there, you'd view the new Batman as flawless.
What I'm really implying here is the moral relativism usually held by the liberal half of the country----but unless someone more intellectual wants to play, I'll just end with this-- It's interesting that you look at the movie and conclude with a "flawed hero" for breaking arbitrary laws. A more libertarian/conservative-minded observer would probably have commented more on the "flawed law system" that prevents for proper crime-fighting.
------
morality IS relative. there are actually only a few tenets that almost all cultures hold, usually being along the lines murder and theft. everything from pig fucking to not eating meat on a friday is subjective to the context of the culture/religion handing out the rules and punishments.
you are not understanding what i mean by flawed hero. it has nothing to do with politics and flawed laws. in literature (which comics and their characters are part of) a flawed or tragic hero is just a protagonist that usually brings about their own death or downfall. look it up. you apparently don't have enough intellect to understand such basic literary concepts such as "hero" and what that entails. a hero is just a protagonist, the main character, the big cheese, the central mechanism to tell the story. batman is the focus, his antithesis in this movie was the joker. shakespeare was big on tragic heroes.
batman is an old story. while there are plenty of stories about the shining example brought low they generally triumph in the end. there are plenty of stories about vigilantes both fiction and non-fiction throughout history. while i'm sure there's plenty anti-terrorism garbage in this movie, it isn't a new concept. a single man standing up and taking the law into his own hands for the greater good is an old theme. think tombstone, val kilmer being the alcoholic gambler who gets a sheriff's badge and later uses it to kill a criminal that everyone wanted to get rid of bit didn't take on. and that's based on actual history.
seeing a political agenda in this can mean a few things: you're paranoid, you're unable to think for yourself and are worried that a movie may do it for you, you are worried other people can't think for themselves and the movie will do it for them, you're worried that a bit of entertainment will somehow make obama president.
you also apparently don't read enough comics to know that there is ALWAYS a segment of the populace that is against the hero in every single hero comic, marvel and dc. people even hate superman and he's a goody-two-shoes douche bag but he's an alien and fighting crime for the cops so HE'S EVIL. fuck even the cops usually end up hating the heroes for doing their jobs. batman is a pretty dark comic now and has been for almost 30 years. i mean for fuck's sake at one point he took on dracula and became a vampire in the struggle there and then was killed. seriously, this isn't news. it's not a lack of intellect, it doesn't need an agenda it pretty much follows the idea behind batman since the 80s.
stop failing.
Submitted by jasumthin (user info) at 2008-07-20 22:53:54 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I got something in mind regarding Heath Ledger. Perhaps i will post it in a few days.
I like your insights
Submitted by PayMeLater (user info) at 2008-07-20 15:29:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
Interesting post.
Why is it here?
Submitted by Wompom (user info) at 2008-07-20 12:37:07 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Ltap (user info) at 2008-07-20 10:34:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Fuck you, haters.
Hollywood ALWAYS has an agenda.
---------------------------
Amen to that
Submitted by Acarnis (user info) at 2008-07-20 10:42:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
whiskey_jack, Batman reaches new outlaw status far earlier than the end of the movie. By focusing on the coverup (the "low point") at the end, you're not only missing the point; but you're also condoning all his previous infractions. If the end wasn't there, you'd view the new Batman as flawless.
What I'm really implying here is the moral relativism usually held by the liberal half of the country----but unless someone more intellectual wants to play, I'll just end with this-- It's interesting that you look at the movie and conclude with a "flawed hero" for breaking arbitrary laws. A more libertarian/conservative-minded observer would probably have commented more on the "flawed law system" that prevents for proper crime-fighting.
Submitted by Ltap (user info) at 2008-07-20 10:34:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Fuck you, haters.
Hollywood ALWAYS has an agenda.
Submitted by whiskey_jack (user info) at 2008-07-20 09:12:46 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hmmm maybe since he was created the character Batman was supposed to be a flawed one? Maybe even half the reason why these movies are considered better than the previous Batman movies is the fact instead of being flashy and entertaining they aim to carry weight and tell a actual story. OH MY GOD! You don't think that perhaps they set the movie at a low point to set up for ANOTHER FUCKING MOVIE! It's called a series douche, and that means ups and downs.
Submitted by Acarnis (user info) at 2008-07-20 06:35:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2008-07-19 19:44:19 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
that's because this is a classic (and by classic i mean EVERYONE EVERYWHERE has always told this kind of story) flawed hero tale.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Not everyone everywhere at all-times lived in whatever liberal city it is you live at, today. Back in the day, a masked crusader restraining a group of criminals would not be grounds for litigation, especially at the site of the crime. I'm sure some places today, maybe even here in the US, would still not mind.
The Batman from Dark Knight is a new animal that actually breaks laws, constantly.
Submitted by Acarnis (user info) at 2008-07-20 06:19:22 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Of course, a bunch of anti-intellectuals and fanboys completely dismiss any attempt at original thought/reflection. Dalai Queso enjoyed the movie just as much as you did, and he's enjoying it more by picking apart the moral message behind it.
This was not the 'classic tale' I've always heard. I don't remember the Batman from previous movies/cartoons/comics being perceived by the public as a threat and murderer. Batman was always called by Commissioner Gordon using the spotlight in the sky. Yet, the movie ends with a destroyed spotlight and with a Batman hated by the public, all too reminiscent to the competing Marvel Comics' Spiderman.
The public should hate him, actually, as this new Batman is far more above the law than ever before. Forget the SWAT-team assault. Hiding a murderer would involve lying on sworn statements; both Bruce Wayne and Commissioner Gordon commit felonies by lying to the public. More unsettling is that they, men of power, do it so easily. You also have Batman using a system akin to wire tapping, a new level of privacy invasion for the caped hero. We can't forget the ever-so-fierce questionings/beatings by Batman. Maybe I should call them alternative interrogation techniques?
It's funny how the Joker calls Batman "incorruptible," while Batman spent the whole movie acting like George W. Bush. (Even moreso, if you consider the whole foreign invasion into China) Either the Joker really did win, or Bruce Wayne votes Republican.
Submitted by marginwalker (user info) at 2008-07-20 06:06:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
vernacular
Submitted by marginwalker (user info) at 2008-07-20 06:06:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
vernacular
Submitted by Unabonger (user info) at 2008-07-20 02:29:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
Your stunning vocabulary is dwarfed in comparison to your complete disregard for paragraph structure. Stop hitting 'enter' so much.
seen better.
Submitted by bjrog2 (user info) at 2008-07-20 01:57:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Umm, www.geekissues.com dude. More people would give a shit over there
Submitted by FunnyAsCancer (user info) at 2008-07-20 01:42:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I'm not quiiite sure I can give you the, Batman is G.I.Bush (Now with Civil Liberty bashing action!) comparison...
But I give you a 2 for having the cohonas to actually think critically and form an independent opinion.
...I am your high school English teacher.
Submitted by Jack_McCallum (user info) at 2008-07-19 23:16:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
It's a Batman movie, not a treatise on the fall of western civilization. Jesus wept.
Submitted by DonkeyOnTheEdge (user info) at 2008-07-19 22:37:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0468569/usercomments-enter
If I see that picture attached to another fucking Uber post I'm going to get I_Have_A_Kristin_Fetish to shut this joint down.
Submitted by Sinistral (user info) at 2008-07-19 21:44:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
omg you just changed my life.
Submitted by Istaros (user info) at 2008-07-19 21:02:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by PepsiCoke (user info) at 2008-07-19 20:56:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Actually, this is an awesome post.
Submitted by PepsiCoke (user info) at 2008-07-19 20:56:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Actually, this is an awesome post.
Submitted by Ducky (user info) at 2008-07-19 20:52:02 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Wompom (user info) at 2008-07-19 20:09:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Dark Knight kicked ass.
Submitted by Hookhand (user info) at 2008-07-19 20:39:07 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
This disappointed almost as much as the movie did.
Submitted by Wompom (user info) at 2008-07-19 20:09:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Dark Knight kicked ass.
Submitted by Banjo (user info) at 2008-07-19 19:44:36 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
I'm not reading all of this because its going to spoil it for me and you are a turd fucker.
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2008-07-19 19:44:19 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
that's because this is a classic (and by classic i mean EVERYONE EVERYWHERE has always told this kind of story) flawed hero tale.
Submitted by frankthebear (user info) at 2008-07-19 19:26:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
THANK YOU FOR SUCKING SO FUCKING MUCH!
Submitted by frankthebear (user info) at 2008-07-19 19:26:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
this sucks harder than everything I've ever posted in my entire Uber-career. THANK YOU!
Submitted by PepsiCoke (user info) at 2008-07-19 19:21:47 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
If you are trying to make the case that it was a stupid movie, then I agree with you.