Oh Sama Been Laude in Europe Peace Deal (629 hits)
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Submitted by TMA (View user info) at 2004-04-15 11:35:23 EDT
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/04/15/binladen.tape/index.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,117148,00.html
How to live in Peace (or live sans terrorism)
by TMA
A person claiming to be Osama Bin Laden has offered a truce with European countries if they pull their troops from Muslim countries. The leaders in Europe have said "they will not negotiate with terrorists."
I say, give into terrorist threats. Let them "win" negotiations; sure why not? The objective is peace right? Then why don't they negotiate with this guy? If some guy has a gun to my head and says, "give me all your money motha fucka...." I say, "Okay here's my money." I would never say, "I do not negotiate with muggers [terrorist]...."
Let's say for a moment, Europe did negotiate with Mr. Osama Bin Laden. Well I would be one of the first people to set sail on the Mayflower in search of a safer existence in Europe. Could you imagine if hoards of Americans took flight to Europe for sanctity? Do you see the irony there?
Ubersiters, I want to know, besides PRIDE, what is so wrong with letting Osama Bin Laden get his way (solely in this instance, no hypotheticals)? We want to live in peace right?
Well give the criminal your money and hope that you will live another day to tell about it. (This is so not the American way) I'm trying to view life from a different perspective and not the John-Wayne get-back-in-the-kitchen-bitch i-don't-drive-jap-cars way!
[check out this damn dirty hippie below]
User Reviews
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-04-16 03:24:39 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Brilliant IDEA!!!
Lets give in to the terrorists demands!!!
You went to public school didnt you?
Submitted by bob (user info) at 2004-04-15 19:17:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
ever time you let them have their way, they will ask for more.
not a bad post TMA. a good discussion starter.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2004-04-15 19:09:50 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
what's that smell ?
Oh! Just the usual yidele's bullshit
Submitted by yidele (user info) at 2004-04-15 18:09:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
sanctity? who's moving to EU for sanctity? You probably meant safety....but in any event, the offer is a joke. Let's look at this in some sort of perspective: /bin/laden, a 6 foot tall arab on dialisys in a deep, deep pakistani cave declares that the single largest political/economic entity on the planet will be safe if just some of the few countries which make it up decide to pull their troops out of the middle east. ( which is what "stopping violence against muslims" really comes down to). It's not as tho' muslims were persecuted in europe - in fact hey have more freedom here than they do in any muslim country, certainly no one is going to shoot them for being the wrong kind of muslim or shake them down for "contributions" to a terrorist war chest with impunity something which happens quite regularly in the middle east.
Aside from the radiculousness of the demand and impossibility of delivering on the promise ( /bin/laden can't even control his kidneys, much less the actions of hundreds of terror splinter groups ), the idea & the precedent of a deperate, besieged & fleeing for his life thug "negotiating" with Europe at large is laughable.
My personal reflection on this matter is that there ought to be alot more shooting of armed wahabi zealots and alot less "negotiating" with terrorists. I don't know how many of you saw Luc Besson's "The Fifth Element", but there is an excellent scene towards the end where a group of ( let's call them terrorists ) is holed up with hostages. The terrorists demand a negotiator & the negotiator sent in shoots the terrorists leader, and politely asks: "Does anyone else want to negotiate?"
This is the only negotiation that the wahabbi or other thugs like them will ever understand, and it is folly to exchange anything with them, except well aimed fire. You cannot successfully negotiate with someone whose avowed aim is your death, because they cannot be bought off. This is elementary & readily understood to most people on a personal basis ( viz. a psycho coming at you with a knife) but apparently when it comes to entities as large as countries, it isn't as intuitive. Much as I loathe the idea, the only way to make wahabi thugs tractable is to appeal directly to their sense of self preservation - with a well placed clusterbomb or a hellfire missile.
Turkey, the only islamic majority country anywhere near being a constitutional democracy, got that way because Kemal Ataturk had the balls to shoot plenty of mullahs thereby laicisizing the turkish army & the state. This fact prompts me to consider shooting wahabi mullahs as perhaps the only workable plan towards a tractable islam & a peacable middle east.
Negotiations can take place between equals & all the wahabi thugs in the world alltogether can't stand on equal footing with any, I repeat, ANY legaly constituted country. This is where the "mugger holding you at gunpoint" metaphor meets the crushing embrace of davy jone's locker.
HST wrote a few years ago: "People just aren't beaten up enough". I find sanity in his madness.
Submitted by Random Joe at 2004-04-15 17:16:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
HAHA, LOL.
everyone got offended and started mentioning America. TMA is talking about Europe retards!!! did you even read what he wrote? did you even catch the news today?
Submitted by Herpes (user info) at 2004-04-15 16:21:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
Thought provoking... if nothing else.
Submitted by Eric <eric.swis.at.yahoo.com> at 2004-04-15 15:10:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
thank you
Submitted by lokisince89 (user info) at 2004-04-15 14:49:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
If you still think we should not be there, take your ass, round up your wife, daughter and mother and get the fuck out. you do not deserve to be part of the greatest and most powerful country in the world where you have responsibilities to humanity.
The people who don't agree with our stopping the torture in Iraq are the same kind of people who thought the holocaust was strictly an internal affair. As a, or some might say the, most powerfull nation we have a resposibility to help others as we are able. With privilage come responsibility.
Submitted by Eric <eric.swis.at.yahoo.com> at 2004-04-15 14:39:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
i didnt say dont watch it. i said research and dont fall for propaganda. dumbass
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2004-04-15 14:28:25 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
"greatest and most powerful country in the world where you have responsibilities to humanity."
Isn't it George Bush who said exactly that during is press conference ?
For someone bashing CNN and FoxCrap you sure look like an individual mind.
Submitted by speeddaimon (user info) at 2004-04-15 14:24:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
I realize this has probably already been stated, but I don't feel like reading through all the responses.
We don't negotiate with terrorists because if we give in to their demands it would set a precedent that we will do it every time. So every time a group has an issue all they have to do is kill a couple thousand americans and we'll give in to them. We would become a constant target for these lunatics. Fuck Europe if they give in, it will be a sign that the French have finally taken over something.
Submitted by Eric <eric.swis.at.yahoo.com> at 2004-04-15 14:24:13 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Just because someone says do what i say or else, do you think it will change the outcome either way? let me ask you a question. if we pull out our troops, do you think that everything will be peaceful and another saddam hussien will not step up? then you'll say fuck em they dont want us there anyway. the average citizen does. do research. stop listenening to the propaganda that c.n.n. and fox news gives out. do research on how the terrorists and saddam tortured and killed innocent women and children. if you still think we should not be there, take your ass, round up your wife, daughter and mother and get the fuck out. you do not deserve to be part of the greatest and most powerful country in the world where you have responsibilities to humanity.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2004-04-15 14:10:44 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Let me add that fighting communism was totally stupid in the first place.
Why would one attack someone who's gonna collapse at the end of the line ?
See North Korea.
Submitted by reallybored (user info) at 2004-04-15 14:02:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Ack, clicked rank to quickly.
Furthermore lets not forget all the advantances made due to compeition between the US and USSR.
Microwave
ENIAC
Hang Gliders
Integrated Circuit
First Comm Sattellite
Corona Spy Sattellite
Minuteman ICBM
ARPANET
Smoke Detector
The Supercomputer
GPS
But your right, that shit is probably useless anyway.
Submitted by reallybored (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:55:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Reallybored: I don't consider a nuclear standoff lasting 55 years, 20 million dead under Stalin, another 80 million dead worldwide, communist genocide, and the destruction and terrorism of sovereign nations (Columbia, South Vietnam) to be working out "prety well".
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As opposed to a direct conflict? Are you insane? Do you any idea the amount of lives that will be lost if we attacked the Soviets directly after WW2? Now if memory serves Russia was nowhere near have a nuke, but during the course of the war (which would have been WW3) one can assume that they probably would have developed that technology. So while ICBMs would probably not have come around during this time, we would still have had nukes bombers.
So instead of 20 million dead your proposaing we should have fought and maybe entered into a nuclear holocaust?
Ok....then.
Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:50:36 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
domenad: he said "of any size"....
Submitted by domenad (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:47:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Razor: Keep a close fuckin' eye on Lichtenstein. Those wily bastards will pull out in a heartbeat. Their truck AND their soldier.
Submitted by Razor (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:44:04 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Every European government of any size has already issued a nasty rejection to this "peace offer"
Submitted by domenad (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:34:52 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Reallybored: I don't consider a nuclear standoff lasting 55 years, 20 million dead under Stalin, another 80 million dead worldwide, communist genocide, and the destruction and terrorism of sovereign nations (Columbia, South Vietnam) to be working out "prety well".
Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:33:50 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
Appeasement of Stalin created the Cold War because we wanted to get out of WWII rather than fight the Soviet troops after we advanced into Germany.
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Might not want to include that, considering it worked out pretty well.
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50+ years of nuclear tension is not working out well to me. Oh well, at least we got a bunch of cool spy movies out of the Cold War.
Submitted by reallybored (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:29:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Appeasement of Stalin created the Cold War because we wanted to get out of WWII rather than fight the Soviet troops after we advanced into Germany.
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Might not want to include that, considering it worked out pretty well.
Submitted by tuesdaydelay (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:19:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I can see the rest of pussy Europe pulling out, leaving us Brits to be terrorised from home by all the shitty muslims we seem to harbour. Bah, is there anywhere they haven't spread?
Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB (user info) at 2004-04-15 13:14:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
TMA,what you're suggesting is appeasement. Appeasement gets you nowhere. It didn't work for Chamberlain with his Peace in Our Time program after Hitler took the Sudetenland. Appeasement of Stalin created the Cold War because we wanted to get out of WWII rather than fight the Soviet troops after we advanced into Germany. Appeasement is only useful as a temporary stall tactic.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:57:51 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
reallybored is the kinda of american I met...and like.
Conscient, with common sense and a drunkard (apparently).
Submitted by reallybored (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:53:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
excuse my horrid spelling/grammar/typo/puncation. Trying to eat and type is a skill i have yet to master.
Submitted by reallybored (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:52:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
A couple of points:
This is not aimed at the US, but at European nations. Now your telling me if your the leader of some little ass country that has 100 troops in the middle east, you wouldnt pull them out? On the chance it might stop a bombing or some other attack on your soil?
Granted i dont believe that terrorist groups will ever stick to their side of the deal, but then again i would believe the US gov (if offered would either).
Furthermore (and this is especially aimed at Dom) you are crazy if you think terrorism will ever go away. What has happened here is the same shit that is happening between the Israeles and the Palenstines [sp). This shit will continue (not Iraq but terrorism against the US, and US interest) for hundreds of years. If you any sort of belief that this will end in our lifetime or your great grandkids lifetime your a sadly mistaken.
Millions of poor uneduated people HATE our culture, lifestyle, and presence in they believe is THEIR land. Add that to the fact that dying for a just cause guarantees entrance to heaven and you have a conflict that has no bounds.
Get fucking use to it.
Submitted by The.Masked.Assailant (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:13:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caulaincourt
Yeah this is soley based on Europe.
America is FUCKED! they HATE us. there isnt much we can do, i want to be a quiter though and move to europe, i would say canada but that would just suck
Submitted by The.Masked.Assailant (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:11:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Anthony, slowlyrotting ,
yeah you guys are right. but i'm hoping that will not happen until the year 2080 when i'm old and dying and dont give a rats ass. and osama and bush and kerry and clinton and mel gibson and everyone that is older than 25 will be DEAD! and i can say, "i lived in peace, but i remember that day, September 11th, 2001....... and after that everything was good.........."
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:08:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
Europeans could make such a deal and live in relative harmony with "terrorist".
But I doubt americans could get away with it just by pulling out troops.
They would have to stop using their veto against UN resolutions blaming Israel.
Stop supporting the current Saudi regime, greatly oppose by saudi fanatics (the same ones who blew up WTC)...
In fact, they would have to do a whole lot of shit and I doubt that would even be enough.
America is kinda forced to fight terrorism. Which is totally NOT what it's been doing since 9/11 (except maybe for Afghanistan).
Face it, Iraq is a fuckin' failure. A new nest of terrorism...american made. And I'm not mentionning all the countries the current administration have pissed off. This will open new doors for terrorists and America has managed to isolate itself in a record time just after recieving unprecedented support from all over the world on 9-11.
Submitted by The.Masked.Assailant (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:07:04 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
DAMNIT RAZOR,
you are messing up my dream. You see i've always wanted to move to london. I lived there for about 6 months when i took a semester at school there. i also loved rome where i lived for about 8 months (messing around: backpacking).
and now Italy and London are sure to be terrorist spots for the next 50 years!!! :-( you're from D.C. so you are used to this shit. but i dont want to be in fear everytime i take the tube. i just want to live my life in peace. i know that there is a lot more to the story and i cant be selfish. but that's the root of why i wrote this; selfish reasons to live in europe.
Submitted by domenad (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:05:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hmm, let's see. Osama wants to return Europe to the Caliphate off the Ottoman empire. So what's going to happen when he decides that all Europeans really should be Muslims? Time to crank up the bombings again. You don't sign a truce with a murderer. Would you have accepted a deal from John Gacy? Yes, I won't murder anymore in exchange for.... FORGET IT, bitch. Osama's a dead man. He just hasn't had sense enough to lie down yet.
Submitted by Razor (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:01:47 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
You are both being idiots. If you don't think it's a concession, you have no clue whatsoever as to what is going on over there.
Submitted by slowlyrotting (user info) at 2004-04-15 12:01:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Titinita (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:54:48 (#)
Ranking: 0
I can gaurantee they'd still blow shit up. They blow each other up on a daily basis.
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agreed... they've been TERRORists since before America was occupying the middle east - as soon as we withdraw, they take over the oil and use the money to fund massive terror strikes across the globe.
Submitted by Dead_0hi0_Sky (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:58:03 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
"John-Wayne get-back-in-the-kitchen-bitch i-don't-drive-jap-cars way!"
-the doctrine of life itself
Submitted by Titinita (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:54:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I can gaurantee they'd still blow shit up. They blow each other up on a daily basis.
Submitted by The.Masked.Assailant (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:51:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Its not a concession, its a deal.
We get rid of troops, they stop blowing shit up.
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RB,
HAHAHAH, exactly my point!!! because that's the overall objective of the whole thing right? if that's not the objective, then perhaps we ARE occupiers???
Submitted by reallybored (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:45:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Its not a concession, its a deal.
We get rid of troops, they stop blowing shit up.
Submitted by Razor (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:44:55 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Not to mention the fact that if the rest of the world pulls out of the Middle East, the Middle East would become even more filled with anachronistic muslim theocracies.
We are in the middle of an ideological war, no matter whether we wish to be a part of it or not.
Submitted by Razor (user info) at 2004-04-15 11:38:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Every time you make a concession, it emboldens not only that foe but future foes.
If people believe they can push you around, they will try.