Creationists are idiots (1749 hits)
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Submitted by Finding The'Mo (View user info) at 2004-12-17 16:47:50 EST
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=41961
My rambling e-mailed response, since he apparently was upset he didn't receive any angry letters wehn he sent this
Mr. Farah, it would seem you, like most religious Americans I have run across, are the victim of a system that teaches you to repeat what you have heard instead of bothering to read for yourself.
Perhaps you were too busy burning books to read them? I'm not sure.
On the one hand I still cannot see why people think evolution and creation theories are mutually exclusive? What better testament to the overwhelming power of the living G_d then having the foresight to create such a system? You give G_d too little credit in that you feel he can only create simple things, apparently making a complex system such as evolution is beyond the Almighty in your own eyes.
You only presented one of the creationist arguments that is the norm, so that's the only one I can respond to. I'm sure any of the others you presented would have been just as laughable.
There is a culture of ignorance in this country, much of it not surprisingly the fault of you and your ilk. But it's the norm. Religion has always opposed scientific progress. Just ask Galileo. Now creationists, unable to prove creationism as true, have shifted gears to downgrading evolution to "just a theory" hoping to put it on equal footing with creationism.
You say, "In the case of evolution, that reason is the theory itself is little more than speculation unsupported by evidence."
Thank you for calling it a theory. In the scientific process you learned in grade school a theory is indeed just a bit above a hypothesis, not a law. However scientists do not use it like that.
The National Academy of Sciences defines a theory as "a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that can incorporate facts, laws, inferences and tested hypotheses."
Our explanation is the fossil record. Yours is "G_d did it". Our explanation is *observed* and *recorded*, actual DOCUMENTED instances of microevolution, and DNA and fossil records that back up Macroevolution. Yours is again "G_d did it".
It was just a few years ago that people believed demons caused sickness. Many still do. How little we've progressed. Whatever we're ignorant about, we prescribe to the spirit world, and are loathe to give it up.
Adding to that, the theory of evolution has something ALL theories are required to have. Falsifiability. A theory, to be accepted, must have the potential to be proven false. Where in "G_d did it." is there that potential? Any elementary logician or debater can tell you that to disprove existence is an impossibility.
So here we arrive. You call evolution a religion. I call you superstitious. A religion is based on faith, when little or no evidence exists to back up religious tenets. On the side of evolution are hundreds of years of documented experiments and research. The theory of evolution is constantly changing to meet new evidence that points it in slightly different directions, as any good scientific theory does. They are not immutable.
Whereas "G_d did it" never changes. It has no evidence to back it up, no experiments, no research, aside from The Bible. Oh wait, I forget. You point to the existence of "dragons" in ancient literature.
Looks like you did it. Congratulations. Hundreds of years of scientific evidence and research by the best and brightest minds of humanity totally falsified because you read a book instead of burning it. Amazing what happens when you try to think outside the box isn't it?
I'll wait for you to do it again, enroll in a local college biology course and try your evidence on a professor there. Or stay secure in your little world where no one challenges your beliefs because you're too afraid to let them in to do so. (By the way, don't you just love the irony inherent in your argument? You deride scientists for as you see it backing "speculation unsupported by evidence" and your evidence is that there were dragons in ancient folklore and literature (and lets not forget "G_d did it ")? Oh man. Your Nobel prize awaits.)
Are there any on Uber who actually believe this garbage that pundits spout?
User Reviews
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-03-26 02:45:41 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I just re-read this and like it better than the first time. Perhaps I was rushed and not paying attention enough. Good job.
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-02-09 17:51:34 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I didn't like how you wrote this 100%, but I agree with your point 100%. Creationists are idiots who spit in the face of logic.
What is great is they call evolution a "theory" because it is not an EXACT science, but it doesn't mean that evolution is merely "one of a bunch of possibilities of how man came to be". It is fact, for all intents and purposes.
I can't stand religious right-wingers....
Submitted by nitty34 (user info) at 2005-02-09 17:38:41 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
uh street the on get they than, them for care and them after look you better more, somthin want they means, you at comin are they if man hell the what?
Submitted by BongZilla (user info) at 2005-02-04 22:54:14 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Prove to me the "missing link", that is still missing, between man, ape, and evolution, and I'll stop believing in creationism. I do believe we all evolve to adapt to our surroundings, and that over time we change for the stronger. But I want to see the evidence where we come from a single celled organism. Until then, sorry but evolution holds no more water than faith.
-BongZilla
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-30 00:02:24 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
BC is closed.
TABC nailed them one too many times for, you'll never believe this...selling alcohol to minors. I know, who can believe that sort of thing goes on at a gay bar?
As to OC consider it a homecoming. Besides I never stay in one place for long, 6th street is made to be wandered
Submitted by whataefag (user info) at 2004-12-29 09:50:31 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I think I've spent far too much time at the Can and Boyzcellar from my undergrad years. But, eh, whatever ... we'll figure it out when the time comes. Have you ever been to the Elephant Room? It's this great blues bar off of 4th. Excellent music half the time, the other half is ... elevatoresque. I heard there was another gay bar that opened there too ... but haven't been back to explore in over a year.
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-28 21:31:01 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
what? I'd be sexy as hell in a cop's uniform
Plus 21 Jump Street was always a favorite of mine, and I look pretty young, so dream come true!
And I know what you mean about the can't wait to leave part, though you should try living where I do...
I was thinking more Oil Can's but either way, Emos is fun too. Hell, all of 6th Street does it for me
Submitted by whataefag (user info) at 2004-12-28 10:40:44 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
getting a masters in graphic design. yes, definitely'll have to hang out sometime. we can hit emo's or something. but it's a looong ay away right now. at least, it seems to me that I'll be waiting forever. funny how when you know you're leaving a place you just can't wait to get the fuck out.
a police officer? c'mon ...
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-27 16:13:39 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Yeah my little attempt to get on most heated. Didn't work though
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-27 16:10:58 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
In May. I decided to hold off the police officer thing for a few years though, thinking about going back to school and getting a degree in advertising, do that for a couple of years.
At any rate, even if I don't end up at UT (giving UC Boulder a lot of thought) I do go to Austin a lot so we'll have to chill.
Grad school in what?
Submitted by whataefag (user info) at 2004-12-27 12:13:01 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
"Creationists are idiots" = Statement of the Obvious 101
I'm moving back to Austin for grad school in Jan. 06, aren't you excited? Just got the scholarship notice last week so it's official. Had to defer for a semester for work reasons, but I can't wait to get back there ...
Aren't you graduating soon?
Submitted by Sideburns (user info) at 2004-12-23 17:14:36 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by ChristPuncher (user info) at 2004-12-20 20:35:07 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
No Comment
Submitted by munkeypants (user info) at 2004-12-19 20:41:27 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by TheScaryGuy11 (user info) at 2004-12-18 13:16:58 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
-1 for anyone referencing Ann Coulter......
+2 well presented argument
Submitted by jack11058 (user info) at 2004-12-18 12:58:14 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
you make some valid points. theism/deism and evolution certainly are not mutually exclusive.
Submitted by GrizzlyHunter62 (user info) at 2004-12-18 03:07:34 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
Man comes from dirt, life inspired by God.
Man comes from amino acids banging around in the core of the earth.
Which one sounds crazier? I'll tell you which. Though producing any empirical evidence for the existence of the God of Abraham is pretty much impossible (some would disagree), I buy that over any of the Big Bang bullshit that I've read. There is no proof for or against God. There is as much proof for as there is against the hypothesis of evolution. I'll take what I grew up on thank you very much.
Did I spell empirical right?
-2 Because I don't like your arrogant post. +1 because at least you're not an idiot and have a clue about what you're talking about.
Submitted by Dead_0hi0_Sky (user info) at 2004-12-17 22:55:29 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
you must be new.
Submitted by Degreeless_Capibara (user info) at 2004-12-17 22:46:38 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Dude, not touching this with a five-meter pole.
Submitted by Death_Metal_Dude (user info) at 2004-12-17 22:36:23 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
"The Koolaid man took a shit, and behold, man was born out of the cherry goodness"
OH SNAP
THAT'S WHY BLOOD IS RED
IT ALL MAKES SENSE
Submitted by Fleshy (user info) at 2004-12-17 21:10:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
because you read a book instead of burning it. Amazing what happens when you try to think outside the box isn't it?
--------------------------------
Nice, I'm gonna have to use that one next time I speak to one of my friends :D
Submitted by FuckTheArmy (user info) at 2004-12-17 20:25:42 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
I agree with you... but seriously, don't bother arguing with them.
Not unless you're gonna hit them over the head with 'On the Origins of Species'.
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 20:19:17 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Actually its more commonly defined in the scientific sense as "an explanation or model based on observation, experimentation, and reasoning, especially one that has been tested and confirmed as a general principle helping to explain and predict natural phenomena."
Evolution fits that criteria. Creationism doesn't. Yet still it's insisted that they be treated as equals.
When creationism as a theory is both (A)Falsifiable and (B)Backed by evidence that doesn't consist of "this is why evolution is wrong" then I will agree to it being taught as a theory. Until then, its about as valid as my saying "The Koolaid man took a shit, and behold, man was born out of the cherry goodness"
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2004-12-17 19:53:27 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Theory = An assumption based on limited information or knowledge.
Both Creationism and Darwinism are theories, albeit Darwinism by far has more empirical support for its claims.
While I completly agree with every one of your points, creationism is still valid as a theory because evolution has not yet been justified as fact.
Ockham's razor implores reasonably minded people to believe in Darwinism, but unless your goal is to abolish people's right of religion, room must be made for those who respectfully dissent from the modern secular view.
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 19:45:52 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
bah if I'd known this was on fark I wouldn't have posted it here
And I treat the word G_d that way out of respect William. If I write the word out, then closing the window would be destroying it.
I only type god if I'm referring to any god such as Zeus or something. But the G_d of Abraham I give props too and mad rizzy pect
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 19:38:40 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
He just wants public education to be as tolerant of his theory as it is of evolution.
Lastly, calling someone an idiot detracts from the credibility of everything you spout. If your intention was to refute creationism, you did it poorly.
I gotta wonder how much of what I wrote you read, or perhaps I didnt write it clearly.
Refuting creationism is impossible, as I said in the post. You can't disprove existence.
Similarly I attacked his wanting creationism to be treated on equal grounds with evolution. His definition of theory goes back to the "scientific method" angle of things you all learned in 6th grade biology. Actual scientific theory is much stronger then the scientific method sort, because it is backed up with evidence and observations.
So yes, evolution is a theory. Creationism is a claim.
Submitted by Academy (user info) at 2004-12-17 19:32:13 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
http://www.ubersite.com/m/54622
Submitted by MoonStone (user info) at 2004-12-17 19:25:43 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
Are there any on Uber who actually believe this garbage that pundits spout?
I hope not
Submitted by jgreening (user info) at 2004-12-17 19:08:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
http://www.ubersite.com/m/54609
Fuck Wizards, Gnomes get what they want because they earned it.
Submitted by CookieLass (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:58:17 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
The judge of all things interesting and educational, as well. And I deem this both interesting and educational. Good work Professor Zoidberg.
Submitted by CookieLass (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:57:03 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:09:54 (#)
Ranking: 0
Dude. You write fanfic based on *Warhammer*, an RPG. Id hardly say you're the judge of all things fun and exciting.
---------------------------------------------
I'm the judge of all things fun and exciting.
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:50:23 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I believe that Creationists are very misinformed and misguided.
With that said, it seems that the author of the article was trying to argue that the theory of evolution should be treated as such, a theory. Its not a scientific principle, its a theory.
He just wants public education to be as tolerant of his theory as it is of evolution.
Lastly, calling someone an idiot detracts from the credibility of everything you spout. If your intention was to refute creationism, you did it poorly. If your intention was to gain the accolades of fundamentally agnostic uberusers and the ire of fundamentally religious, well done.
Heres your big fat zero.
Submitted by crx (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:41:16 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
People like this probably just make up random contradictory ideas in order to get attention... kinda pathetic.
Submitted by dodahdave (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:37:01 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Crap! I'm an idiot. So much for my evolutionary chances!
Here's the +2 I meant to give.
Submitted by dodahdave (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:36:19 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
+2 because I just posted a long response to this guy after I saw the link on Fark.
I tried to remain as calm as I could, because I believe that part of the problem is there is a lack of those who think evolution is a good model and who can communicate well.
Submitted by William_Q_Percy (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:29:59 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I like how you treat the word God as if it were profanity.
Submitted by MickGinny (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:24:53 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Uh, yea. i have a mouse with a scroll button. this doesnt repair my rating to the intended +2. but hey, you should be amazed that i was this considerate. I am.
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:19:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
No, his evidence seems to genuinely consist of the fact that there were dragons in literature.
At least he's not a raving lunatic about it, but still, I hate the forces of creationism with probably as much vigor as I do those trying to discriminate against gay. What it all boils down to is ignorance and a desire to stay that way, pure and simple
But again, I invite any creationists on uber, do your worst. Bring up some arguments that don't include "G_d did it" and I'll try to counter them. Im fairly well versed, and anything I don't get I'll forward to my old bio prof. Its gonna be a longgggg day at work
Submitted by loki (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:10:13 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Do you think it's possible that this guy is just writing this stuff to get responses, Ann Coulter style?
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:09:54 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by domenad (user info) at 2004-12-17 16:51:33 (#)
Ranking: -2
How boring.
Dude. You write fanfic based on *Warhammer*, an RPG. Id hardly say you're the judge of all things fun and exciting.
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:08:09 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
is it on fark too? I'll have to check
a religious friend of mine sent this to me, he's always arguing against evolution with me, very tenacious sort
Submitted by William_Q_Percy (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:07:20 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
The other main precept to that theory is that time doesn't really exist as the way we see it.
What is infinite already is. We just experience it in a very strange, linear, and irreversible fashion.
Every single incident in the infinite already 'is'. This includes God, even though we have yet to witness the birth of such a creature.
I'm not saying it is a perfect theory, but its a pretty good way to explain what I believe.
Submitted by William_Q_Percy (user info) at 2004-12-17 17:04:18 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I saw that article up on Fark a few minutes ago...
The first thing that came across my mind when I was reading the opening was
"gee, I wonder why you got no calls to your radio show from evolutionists... could it be perhaps that there are no evolutionists listening to your show? Could that be perhaps because you talk about moronic things like the existence of dragons in stories as proof against evolution?"
What a tool.
It's VERY nice to read about someone else who shares the view that the concept of an intelligent design includes the application of a complex system such as evolution.
I've been toying with the idea that, in essence, God created God through the means of allowing life to evolve to a greater being. Humanity is only one step in the evolutionary ladder... along with every other living thing on the planet. I think it is safe to assume, though, that the next dominant species to be borne out of human kind will be that much closer to being godly.
In other words, my idea is that the purpose of life on this planet is to evolve to the point where God is created. As if earth were a little godseed.
I know the thoery is a bit of a stretch, but I am trying to think on the scale of the infinite here. If you allow evolution on this earth to continue indefintely, assuming that evolution branches out in all directions, there will be always be a dominant (and thus, best suited to survive) species. I can just picture a species coming out of humanity that would be able to utilize the potential of the mind more effectively, and not have to rely on the 'truths' of good and evil to define every one of their actions.
I dunno, just a thought.
Submitted by MickGinny (user info) at 2004-12-17 16:57:32 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Some would disagree and say that the Serbs are the idiots.
Submitted by polyamorousaj (user info) at 2004-12-17 16:55:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Well said.
I tend to stay out of religious arguments for the exact reason you've presented.
There is no way to disprove the existence of God.
Submitted by GodLovesALittleLovin (user info) at 2004-12-17 16:53:16 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
i believe that we were all created in a donut factory by midgets 12,000 years ago because god likes to fuck with our heads. If midgets could only tap into their true powers like shooting electricity out of their fingers they would rule the world once again.
Submitted by domenad (user info) at 2004-12-17 16:51:33 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
How boring.