In response to Apollo's "Fighting for your country means fuck all" (2135 hits)
Category: GeneralRating: 1.43 on 106 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by Mario (View user info) at 2005-06-07 10:46:34 EDT
Was initially a response to http://www.ubersite.com/m/67705 but it got long enough to be its own post. Read all of it before you start writing in response.
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Apollo, up until this point I've enjoyed a lot of the material you've written. After reading your most heated post, however, I feel you've been exposed for the utter tosser you are. I'll address the what angers me most first.
"Yeah, you are doing your job, poorly, but don't try and tug on these heart strings you pampered overpaid under worked buffoons."
Guess what our job is in Iraq right now? It is to set up the infrastructure and then get the fuck out. I don't want to be there, Mister Al-Abib doesn't want me there either. As the officer in charge of an infantry platoon, my job will, traditionally, be to seek and destroy. But guess what? I've been hearing from both my friends who are over there right now, in that capacity, and generals, that I'll be spending more of my time trying to establish a sewage system more advanced than, say, "let all our shit run into the middle of the street and sit there". When I get back from patrols, my time will be taken up overseeing the set-up of amenities bastards like you and I take for granted (paved roads, electricity, sewage systems, etc). I'm more than happy to do it as well, because a clean paved road makes someone's life better, when faced with the alternative of a disease spreading, sewage collecting dirt path. I've seen Iraqi kids standing in said sewage...without shoes. If you delve a little bit below the surface of what's being presented to you on television and in the papers, you'd see that there is much evidence that we are in fact doing our job well.
Soldiers are pampered, are they? That's pure ignorance. Have you ever actually lived the life of a soldier, or been good friends with one? Do you KNOW what the daily life of a soldier is like, especially one in Iraq or Afghanistan? I hear lots of people complain about working 50+ hours a week, and acting like 80 hours a week is murder. Chances are, you're in a nice air-conditioned office at a computer where you can occasionally sneak around online to entertain yourself (they should invent a website to cater to that). You are surrounded by people that, although you may dislike, aren't trying to fucking put a hole in your head 7.62 mm in diameter (entry) and about the size of your gorilla fist (exit). You aren't in 120 degree heat, wearing hot clothing under even hotter body armor. What do you eat? Pretty much whatever the fuck you want. You have lunch breaks, you drive to wherever you wish to eat. Jelly donuts? Pizza? Fish and chips? You don't have to eat de-hydrated "chicken breast" do you? Mmmm....chunked and formed. If you've ever eaten an MRE, you know it clogs the pipes and you'll be dropping one brick of a shit two weeks later. At the end of the day, you can escape it all and go back to the refuge of your house. Notice that you didn't have vans full of insurgents wielding shitty mass produced Soviet rifles trying to ram your Scoda, or buses laden with 300 kilos of explosives pulling up next to you. We are all pampered, including myself. I'm on leave, and loving every minute of doing nothing, I cherish it. I have a warm bed, clean clothes, home-cooked meals, television , as much sleep as I want, a gym, and a computer. This time last year, I had a large rock to sleep on (it was cold, which was nice in contrast to the blistering heat), ticks, maybe 3-4 hours of sleep (if not on a mission), and a pain in my stomach that almost incapacitated me because I hadn't eaten in five days. I'm royally pampered right now, I'll be the first to say it. But don't you dare say my soldiers in combat are fucking pampered.
Overpaid? Ha, right. You're a fucking idiot. With my education I could be making 6 figures in the civilian sector. What am I paid as a second lieutenant? Here, have a look.
I make exactly $2343.60 per month. Multiply that by 12 and you get just over $28,000 a year. While it's not measly, it is also far from being lavish. Do you know how much a Private makes in their first year? $14,800. Do a little bit of research, it's good for you.
http://www.military.com/Resources/ResourcesContent/0,13964,49020,00.html
A mercenary in Iraq right now starts off, on average, with about $150,000 a year. Of course, these men are highly trained and specialized, usually ex-special operations operatives, but they make far more than their contemporaries still in the military.
If we wanted to be making a lot of money, we wouldn't be soldiers. In general, we don't mind being paid less than we should, we're in the military for other reasons. But when some twat calls us overpaid, I feel compelled to step in.
Underworked...yes, a 105 hour work week is slacking quite a bit isn't it? That's the work week of a junior officer in combat, and that doesn't even count the time taken up trying to keep our soldiers sane and as happy as possible, which any officer worth a shit is more than glad to do. Even a brand-new buck private over in Iraq works far more hours than you do, Apollo. If I'm wrong, please, correct me.
Now, to address the "buffoon" comment...some of the most intelligent people I've ever met are soldiers. I've dated women in Princeton, Harvard, Columbia...but you know what, some of the soldiers I met a year ago are far smarter than those ladies (sorry girls). Are you familiar with the 18X (x-ray) program? I assume not, you seem to know fuck all. Basically, it transitions someone from being a civilian to being a Special Forces sergeant in about 2-3 years. I happen to know a lot of X-rays, I was in the sticks with them and we were a tight knit bunch. One of them, let's call him "Shawn", was educated at Harvard and had a job on Wall Street making about $200,000 a year. After doing that for a couple of years, he decided to join the Army. He was knowledgeable in every topic I talked with him about and extremely eloquent. He had well-formed opinions backed with fact. His IQ (for all that's worth) is 145, which puts him about 15 points over being a certifiable genius. In fact, the average IQ in the special forces is just under 140. "Normal" Army soldiers also are very intelligent people, for the most part. Many have undergraduate degrees, quite a few have Masters or PhDs. I don't claim that we're all geniuses, I don't claim to personally be one either. But calling the average soldier a buffoon, coming from you, is quite comical.
Most soldiers had many options open to them in life. To say they were too stupid to do anything else is low on your part. Let me relate this to me, personally. I could be making 6 figures right now with my education. I was offered admission to Ivy League schools, offered to run track. Instead, I went to West Point for 4 years, and oh my, what a hard 4 years that was. I gave up any semblance of a normal social life. My isolation cost me a life with the only woman I've ever been in love with. Now, as an officer, I can't have a normal relationship with the kind of woman I like because I'm either in training, or will be deployed, constantly. My unit is a quick-reaction one, which means that whenever something pops up, we get priority to deploy. And that's when we're home from Afghanistan or Iraq. I am physically breaking down, as the arches in my feet have collapsed. Do you know how painful that is? That's what happens when you lug around 50 kilos on your back. I have been starved, I've bled, I've broken bones, I've had contusions.
But you know what? I love my job. I felt honored to be able to "pay back" this country, in a way. You see, I came to the USA when I was 8 years old from a third-world country with a corrupt government. I'm half English, lived there for a bit, lived in Germany, lived in France. But nowhere was I immediately accepted and embraced like here in the United States. It has a hell of a lot of problems, a lot of Americans can be pig-headed and close-minded, and I sure as hell don't agree with a lot of our politics, but it has still been a great home for me. That is a partial reason for doing what I do. The other, more important reason to me, is that I love being around soldiers. They are great people and they continuously amaze me. My mission is to get as many of my soldiers home alive and healthy, and to have a bit of fun while I'm at it and attempt to make their lives just a bit better. A soldier, you will find, usually isn't fighting for his or her country. They are fighting for their fellow soldier next to them. We know that if we needed help, our friend would help us without hesitation and we in turn would do the same. We'd die for each other. The reason so many of us come home alive is because the dead men keep on fighting. What is it that YOU do, Apollo, that makes what my soldiers do seem so worthless?
This isn't meant to pull at heartstrings, especially yours, you douche. We don't want your pity, we just want your respect. We'll even settle for not being disrespected. Until given reason not to, I respect people. I don't think I'm better or worse than anyone else, we all do our own thing. But if you choose to insult the soldiers, please at least back it up with something. I'm open minded, if you have something grounded in fact to say, by all means, I'll listen.
User Reviews
Submitted by munkeypants (user info) at 2005-06-13 15:30:50 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
holy shit.
Degreeless's comment was dead on.
Submitted by BigCore (user info) at 2005-06-10 08:46:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
"Do you think you had a chance in WW2 if Russia wasn't in the war?" Personally? Hell no.
"Do you think you would have been able to defeat Germany if the British hadn't held off the reich for so long?" Perhaps, but the chances of it would have been virtually non-existant. More of the problem is that we seemed to be more concerned with kicking the shit out of the Japanese than helping Europe.
"Do you think the British could have held on so long if the Germans had conquered the oilfields which were defended by Australian troops?" Don't know too much about that, can't answer.
"Do you think the Japanese could have been defeated without Chinese resistance?" Yes. In the end, we didn't defeat them militarily, now did we?
Submitted by DarthFaded (user info) at 2005-06-09 15:57:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
OohRah Sir.
USMC.
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2005-06-09 15:19:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by DCWoody (user info) at 2005-06-09 14:08:35 (#)
Ranking: 0
There are/were British troops in Iraq from the TA, which means some of them only work 21 days a year.
For full pay.
Which is why we Brits get annoyed at some soldiers who complain.
Yes you're being shot at, but you joined the fucking army, what did you expect.
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I thought your TA was like our reservists, they do one weekend a month, two weeks a year of work. That is until wartime when they do it full time. while they are doing the one weekend a month their pay is miniscule, they don't get a full wage.
Submitted by DCWoody (user info) at 2005-06-09 14:08:35 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
There are/were British troops in Iraq from the TA, which means some of them only work 21 days a year.
For full pay.
Which is why we Brits get annoyed at some soldiers who complain.
Yes you're being shot at, but you joined the fucking army, what did you expect.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-09 11:45:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I answered a rhetorical question...damn.
You could be right about Apollo, all I know is that he definately got a rise out of me.
Ohio, I've never seen or heard about Iraqis doing that, but that DEFINATELY happens in Afghanistan. When the 82nd was deployed there, they came to know of a guy called "The Dude". Not like in the Big Lebowski, but another kind of dude. Apparently, in Afghan villages there is always one male chosen at birth to be the village bitch. They see having sex with a woman for pleasure or anything other than reproductive purposes as a sin. So, when men of the village get "the itch", they go to town on "The Dude". Sex with a man, for pleasure, is apparently ok. They can do this up until they hit 35, then it's considered gay. Joes would be scanning the landscape with their thermal sights or IR goggles and see The Dude in action. This could all be crap, but it's what I've been told by several soldiers. Once I'm over there, I'll know if it's accurate or not.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-09 11:37:30 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Someone deployed in Iraq right now, with a very active mission (such as infantry, and loads of others), easily works that many hours a week, even more. That's assuming you're working 15 hours a day, leaving 9 for sleep and personal time. More often than that, you don't get that much time off, you're constantly busy. There are highs and lows of activity. Never, and I mean NEVER, have I worked anywhere close to as little as 20 hours a week.
Submitted by DCWoody (user info) at 2005-06-09 10:32:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
One teeny tiny point, how many weeks per year are you working 105 hour and how many are you doing<20.
Yes its a rhetorical question.
I think Apollo may have heard some story of someone getting annoyed for actually having to fight a war when they joined in peacetime, and generalised the entire sodiering proffession in his rage.
Submitted by Dead_0hi0_Sky (user info) at 2005-06-09 10:19:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
respect.
by the way, i heard a rumor that some iraqis have teh ghey buttsecks, out in public, in broad day light. is there any truth to this? and if so, send pics.
Submitted by Flying_buttmonkey (user info) at 2005-06-09 07:35:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Hang on, that's my fucking car in the background!
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-08 23:27:08 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I would have had I known how things were going to go down. What branch are you in Train? You wouldn't by chance be a black hat would you?
Submitted by Freight_Train (user info) at 2005-06-08 22:34:09 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
you should have enlisted first
fucking cadets
Submitted by gamma (user info) at 2005-06-08 09:35:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by Flack (user info) at 2005-06-08 09:03:13 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
This pleased me, sir. First team!
Submitted by Flying_buttmonkey (user info) at 2005-06-08 07:42:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
You know 'that kid' everyone went to school with that went on and on and on about how great they were and how everything they did was right even when sometimes it was fucking stupid and didn't listen to their elders, who had seen it all before? Remember how it pissed off everyone else, even if the kid was quite nice, despite all that?
Well I'm sorry to say it but you guys are 'that kid'. I'd like to think that at some point America will stop singing it's own praises and interfering in everyone else's countries long enough to listen to those who have been around doing this shit for a lot longer. The American people are all really great so long as you don't challenge anything they say, as far as I can tell.
Aside from that though, this was a good point. I'm not saying I agree with all of it but it needed to be said. I have no problem with the people of 'Merica although I will ask that you pass on to your army mates if they'll please stop blowing up our troops by accident. Thanks. We're trying to kill the trrrrrrrsts too.
Submitted by Nobb (user info) at 2005-06-08 01:50:53 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I know the study you're talking about (i'm a psych student) but they never went anywhere near this extent. It was also not 'real life'. I do accept that these people wouldn't have had to been psychotic to do what they did. I'm just interested in whether this kinda shit goes on a lot more than we here about? I know we wouldn't have heard about abu graib if it wasn't for the person giving the pictures to the news; i'm sure they've learnt there lesson since then.
To me personally it just seemed like the soldiers were being scapegoated.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2005-06-08 00:05:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Oh don't worry, Canada has its own problems to deal with.
Here's one. The government has been promoting nationalism to fight against separatism for a decade now. The results of that? Seperatism is hotter than before and we have a new generation of patriotic canadian fuckheads taking over. The problem however, it's that the list of things to be proud of is pretty small (especially when we are so dependant of the US). This is where anti-americanism comes in to fill in the gap. "Our beer is better than yours! Our hockey players rock the planet! We kick your ass at lacrosse!" and such meaningless retarded shit is now the new trend.
Bah...there's so much to say without camping this post forever. Although I would probably enjoy discussing this in length with you. You seem laid back and we have pretty different backgrounds, therefor clashing perspectives.
Good night!
Submitted by joedaddy (user info) at 2005-06-07 23:50:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Mario, Apollo is young and ignorant.
Given time, he will correct one of these "problems".
<anobody>
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 23:43:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hmm...yes, that makes sense Caul, I know what you're saying. The public isn't nearly as fervent as the media, but still very very supportive. I think that while the media has good intentions in glorifying us, it is most "PC" from both left and right wing stances to wholeheartedly support us. The uproar and bad image that would result in anything negative being said about the troops as a whole, at least in our current socio-political climate, would potentially destroy a large media source. (Look up Michael Crook, that fool was smoked out immediately...he was an idiot, but maybe someone more intelligent could have a valid point...I don't like to think so, but I don't discount the possibility). So, just to be safe, maybe a little bit too much back patting goes on. Again, we really really appreciate the support, but I think that if our Canadian friends, who are not so different from us and are our neighbors, begin to see us as overzealous and on the edge of nationalism, a step needs to be taken back and perhaps some self-analysis and slight correction should take place. If you guys see this, I hate to think of the kind of fuel we're supplying our enemies with overseas, as they have utterly different cultures from our own. Nationalism and imperialism go hand-in-hand historically, and if we start acting nationalistic, would it be at all hard for a place like Syria or Iran to accuse us of wanting to occupy the Middle East? Hello new wave of insurgents and terrorists. Shit, if I was convinced that some foreign power was trying to take over my home, I'd go guerilla on their ass too. The media, though essential, unfortunately wields too much influence, both here and over there. People tend to believe what a higher authority says, even if it is skewed or ass backward. The media should be as factual as possible, and not the political tool it somehow always ends up becoming. I don't have an answer to that.
I ramble on too much...as with everything else, I've learned that a bit of balance is essential. Thank you for the perspective Caul, I didn't know it was like that. To reiterate, we love being supported, we really do...but I would rather have a grounded support based on respect than one of blind following. I hope it doesn't shift to that.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2005-06-07 23:15:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I got the point of your post Mario. It was pretty good too. Though I'm not sure it was an appropriate response to apollo, since I think you missed the message he was trying to pass, which was basically what you said: soldiers aren't gods. Anyway...
"No, we're not super humans better than everyone else, and I'm apalled if I gave off the impression of thinking that"
No you didn't give that impression. However, the american public does. Or is it your media? I don't know, but your nation certainly is, as I already mentionned, the only one to go nuts over its military.
I think that greatly contributes to the "facist" perception that many have of your country. So not only does it annoy you to be glorified all the time, it's not helping you either. It's a lot easier to promote hate toward americans with that image they project.
Do you get my point?
Submitted by thorpe (user info) at 2005-06-07 23:11:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Well fucking said. This needed to be posted.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 23:06:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
The scandals are all results of bad leadership in one way or another. There have been numerous psychological experiments conducted showing that under a prisoner/guard system, almost everybody who is a guard will, within days, begin to abuse their power and act very unlike themselves. The only way to overcome that is strong leadership to continuously ground the guards back to reality and accountability. Those studies took place out at Stanford, if my memory serves me well.
Submitted by Nobb (user info) at 2005-06-07 22:52:53 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
You seem like an honest guy. Are the soldiers that pull shit like Abu Graib the bad apples? Are they just under orders from the CIA? (pretty likely). Are most soldiers like yourself?
Submitted by knucklesnelson (user info) at 2005-06-07 22:50:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Right on mary-oooooooo
Submitted by notoriousbrett (user info) at 2005-06-07 20:20:25 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I was going to say a lot about how I respect soldiers and what they do, even if the causes are something I don't always support. But then my fingers got tired.
So I +2ed this.
Submitted by android (user info) at 2005-06-07 20:17:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I still have yet to see a shred of proof to the accusations thrown out there by apollo regarding praise or glorification of our troops. What do you think happens here ? Not sure where your gettin your information from but it's not what you think. Could you give atleast one example of what you're referring to?
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 18:20:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Caul, the point of this post was not to try to get people to worship the Army or soldiers. Both have problems, as does anything else. Heck, I wish we weren't glorified so much all the time. No, we're not super humans better than everyone else, and I'm apalled if I gave off the impression of thinking that...we are a representation of the society from which we come. We are like everyone else, we're just doing a different job. If you are disrespected, are you not quick to stand up for yourself? We don't care for all the "hero worship" that goes on, we really don't. While we appreciate it, it gets very uncomfortable to continuously have to take compliments for what we feel is just doing what we're supposed to be doing. We have no control over how the public feels about us...if we did, we'd never have been spit on back in the days of Vietnam and we wouldn't be glorified such as we are today. I would like a happy median, something akin to how any other professional is viewed. There are attention whores in the armed forces, as there are other places. Also, though perhaps it was aimed at striking a nerve with the American public, the post itself was written directly in the context of speaking to a soldier. It spoke to ME. What I write is MY reality, I don't presume to think it is THE reality. It's my experience of the world, and I put it out there. Ultimately, such things are only right if they are in congruence with your own reality, or if they ARE your reality. It's all context. The only thing I'm arguing is that we are not overpaid, we're not dribbling oafs, and that we are not underworked. I don't have an answer for the higher issues being discussed here, for they are without answer...they are issues of opinion. Oh, and 6 figures is not hyperbole. Had I chosen to go into accounting, for example, or get an MBA from one of the schools I could have gone to, I'd be getting that. Barely, but sure enough, I'd be getting that. If you, Caulaincourt, decided to be a tax attorney for a major corporation and got the qualifications to be one, you'd be making well over 100k to start off with...but you'd also have what is, in my opinion, a very boring job...at least for me. If one wants to make a high salary the highest priority in life, chances are, they'll get it. I used that example as leverage against the opinion that soldiers have no other options...I had several. I wasn't gloating...I'm NOT making 6 figures, and even if I was, that wouldn't make me smarter or better than anyone else.
Submitted by bigfish (user info) at 2005-06-07 18:14:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I should use that review for my UberMadness submission.
Submitted by bigfish (user info) at 2005-06-07 18:13:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I think that like the abortion issue, there are two polar opposites arguing here. Both sides are partially right, and both are partially wrong. Both are overreacting.
The way I see it, there are two sides. The pro-American troops side and the anti-American attitude side. Both are arguing two completely different points, which somehow overlap each other enough for there to be a debate. The former are defending American troops by saying that they're merely defending themselves, they aren't just mindless grunts and so on. The latter claim that American troops are overpaid, overpraised killers. Both sides have a point, no? It's just that they're on completely different planes.
There is no debate that the Iraq war was unjustified. There are people who claim it wasn't, but they're morons. Normally, I would look at their side, but, as with Creationists, I have yet failed to witness a coherent debate from them. The troops didn't decide to go, though. Some want to help their country, many are probably young people trying to get a college tuition. Then there's the Afghanistan invasion. That, I feel, was justified. There are two sides to that, but most people agree that the war in Afghanistan was justified, since the government was obviously linked to and harbored terrorists, unlike Iraq.
Then there is the question about US wars in the past. I've seen claims of genocide, unjustified wars, and many other things. This is going completely off the track of the post, which is my point. There is no denying that the United States committed genocide on a few occasions. Most people know about slavery, which wasn't genocide in the textbook definition. Many people also know about the deliberate genocide of the Native Americans. Yes, I know there was killing on both sides, but if you justify killing them because they killed you, then you completely throw out your arguement that Americans are killing Iraqis to defend themselves. We killed them first, we persecuted them first. They weren't soldiers accustomed to the standards of war, they were a civilization living in peace. Fewer people know about the Japanese Internment, where we put the Japanese in concentration camps. They were by no means a death camp, but it was a hypocritical moment in US History. Not many people know about the killings of thousands of Pacific Islanders after the Spanish-American war. I can't remember all the details, except that thousands of Filipino, maybe even hundreds of thousands of civilians were killed by Americans.
By now I'm just throwing fodder at both sides to chew up, but I'll end by getting to the point of both posts. It's true that troops are paid tons more than our boys ever got fifty years ago. Instead of coming home to apathy or even hostility, they come home to open arms and celebrations. I don't believe they are overpaid, however. They have a tough job, they do their job, and they get paid a fair compensation for their duties. I don't think it's their fault that they get so much praise, it's the media's fault. We're living in a very patriotic--almost nationalistic--society now. Kind of reminds me of pre-WWI Europe, except we don't have anyone to fight except Canada or Mexico, and we already know how we fared against one of them (I'm not counting War of 1812 because Canada was still basically an English colony, and both of us were totally underdeveloped).
-Degreeless
Oh yeah, http://www.lemonparty.org
Submitted by shitfuck (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:56:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
I have a very healthy five figure salary, and I can tell you it's not the sixth digit that makes the difference, it's the fact that I can fire people at random and throw them from my office window if productivity falls.
That alone is worth a cool seven digits per year.
And a blow job from Jesus's mom.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:51:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 16:41:42 (#)
Ranking: 0
Berty, you're one of the more intelligent people to respond against this post, I respect that. You raise some very good points. Yes, I will kill people. I hold no delusions that it won't affect me. I hate the idea of doing it, and I know I'll struggle with it once it happens. I'm human. Am I really qualified to decide if a person lives and dies, and then act on that? In a way, killing another person is playing God. In exchange for ending a few lives, I'll live with that fact the rest of my life. I will be a killer. I wish there were no war, but there is, and wishing it away doesn't change human nature. We've always killed each other, and I'm afraid we always will. Lets not forget, I may myself be killed. I'm only 22, but I'm not foolish enough to think I'm bulletproof. I've already lost friends, when that happens the feeling of one's own mortality is all the more believable. Hopefully I'll be lucky enough to help more people than I hurt. I believe I can. If not, if I see grave injustice taking place and I feel I bring more harm than good to this world, believe me when I tell you, I'll be the first to walk away first chance I get. But from what I have seen, I believe I'll be able to help some people, I have faith in that. As you said, I am merely a tool, but maybe I can do some good on my small level.
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Your a good man Mario, I have a lot of respect for you. It boggles the mind to see you in the army. Those massive hands of yours would be better suited to holding a newborn baby or an artists brush than a rifle.
I wish I could change my opinion on these things but I can't for the reasons I've already stated. Your a credit to your country but not in so limited a capacity as a soldier.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:41:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Apollo's point was that soldiers don't have to be constantly praised and glorified every 5 seconds or so. His post was mostly directed at the american public. He just added a few insults in there to make the debate more heated. It worked.
Maybe I should make a 6 figure salary (nice hyperbole there buddy) too because obviously my reading comprehension is better than yours and I'm not an anglo.
I'm all for respecting soldiers. It's a tough job that goes right up there with policemen or firefighters or maybe even doctors. But can you explain why america is the only 'civilized' country who laud its soldiers and declare them holy saints every single day?
Would you go as far as to suggest that it's because your military men are superior humans, they are worth more? Or would it be because the american population is backward if not utterly retarded compared to the rest of the civilized world?
There is difference between respect and dumbass worship.
Submitted by jumpinjellyfish (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:30:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Damn...I'm impressed Mario.
Submitted by williamson (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:26:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by cuberat (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:02:05 (#)
Ranking: 2
Even though I am totally against the war...I have to +2 this because it's the truth.
And to that cunt who said that Europe is going to kick our ass because of having to back us up all the time...You fucking ungrateful eurotrash in western europe owe your very lives to us. If we wouldn't have bailed you out in WWII, bailed you out during the cold war, and given you enough economic aid over the last 60 years to build you up to where you are, you would all be speaking German and/or Russian and working in forced labor camps or being systematically executed.
We saved your ass in the war. We gave you all the money to rebuild. We protected you in the Cold War. Now all you do is complain about us. Fuck, I don't like our politicians either. I said above I'm against the war. But why don't you people shut the fuck up and thank us for once like the people in Eastern Europe who know what its like to live under opression and foreign domination. We have helped them since the fall of the Iron Curtain and they are grateful.
-=-=-=-==--==--=-=-=-=-=-=-=--==--=
Who won the American War of Independence?
... AMERICANS?! Ha! I think not. You'll actually find French forces were the greatest contributors to that little anti-British rebellion.
Point is most countries have saved eachothers' arses in history. You yanks should stop trying to pretend you are the only reason the war was won.
Do you think you had a chance in WW2 if Russia wasn't in the war? No.
Do you think you would have been able to defeat Germany if the British hadn't held off the reich for so long? No.
Do you think the British could have held on so long if the Germans had conquered the oilfields which were defended by Australian troops? No.
Do you think the Japanese could have been defeated without Chinese resistance? No.
In both great wars you Americans step in at the last minute, cast the final blow and act like you won the entire war for everyone. Yes, the war couldn't have been won without America but America couldn't have won without the rest of the Allies. Stop pretending that your nuking the japs gives you some sort of moral highground to use over the rest of the world for a dozen lifetimes.
Submitted by android (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:14:21 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
well done mario
Submitted by williamson (user info) at 2005-06-07 17:13:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Appollo's a douche who probably bitches when the air con in his office isn't working but thinks the soldiers have it easy and "because they are getting paid" shouldn't be getting any respect.
Newsflash you fat limey fuck: Most soldiers don't join the army as a job, they join it as a duty.
Submitted by Natsukau (user info) at 2005-06-07 16:57:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
+2 because I had a relative die in Iraq. He deserves some admiration for dying to protect us people who do not have the courage, health, or youth to do so ourselves. If you real think that little of your national soldiers, I pray the Germans come back and blitzkrieg your shitty village so we can see if you change your mindset.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 16:54:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
And for the rest of the gang...
LOOK AT ME, I'M SHOUTING! THIS MAKES ME RIGHT! YEAH!..............MUTHAFUKKA!
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 16:41:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Berty, you're one of the more intelligent people to respond against this post, I respect that. You raise some very good points. Yes, I will kill people. I hold no delusions that it won't affect me. I hate the idea of doing it, and I know I'll struggle with it once it happens. I'm human. Am I really qualified to decide if a person lives and dies, and then act on that? In a way, killing another person is playing God. In exchange for ending a few lives, I'll live with that fact the rest of my life. I will be a killer. I wish there were no war, but there is, and wishing it away doesn't change human nature. We've always killed each other, and I'm afraid we always will. Lets not forget, I may myself be killed. I'm only 22, but I'm not foolish enough to think I'm bulletproof. I've already lost friends, when that happens the feeling of one's own mortality is all the more believable. Hopefully I'll be lucky enough to help more people than I hurt. I believe I can. If not, if I see grave injustice taking place and I feel I bring more harm than good to this world, believe me when I tell you, I'll be the first to walk away first chance I get. But from what I have seen, I believe I'll be able to help some people, I have faith in that. As you said, I am merely a tool, but maybe I can do some good on my small level.
Submitted by Dash (user info) at 2005-06-07 16:27:29 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
On behalf of America, thank you.
Submitted by simple_catalyst (user info) at 2005-06-07 16:05:08 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
(in very bad drawn out sing/song voice):
"come oooon peoooople now,
smile on your broooooother,
everybody get-to-gether try
to love one anoooother"
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2005-06-07 15:03:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:53:32 (#)
Ranking: 2
34C.
Sorry. I was off.
------------------------------------------------------------------
That's great! I hope all your kids will be born healthy and well formed as a consequence, you crazy, gun-toting, puppy lovin', redneck. You'll make a great dad. Seriously.
Submitted by Vulva (user info) at 2005-06-07 15:01:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Current and ex-military Ubercon in the near future? We can form axis and alies - then we shall see the superior minds/machines of Uber....
J/K Great post and I agree. You don't have to give me a parade...just don't spit on me when I come home.
Ummm..Go Navy
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:53:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
34C.
Sorry. I was off.
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:52:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
37ish
Submitted by JonnyX (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:46:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
"There is something about Marine training that seems to remove the ability to admit error or to see another's point of view. I can see why America would find this necessary, but I can't respect it.
In fact there are very view institutions that I do respect, I respect you for what you have written but I cannot intrinsically respect Marines."
________________
First off, ASSHOLE, if you'd bother to check, you'd see that all the 'torture' was done by Army soldiers, not Marines.
Secondly, you wouldn't even know THE FIRST FUCKING THING about Marine training, so SHUT YOUR FUCKING CAKEHOLE, BITCH.
I'm in San Diego, and I KNOW some DI's and officers you can talk to. And they'll tell you what they've told me: you can't defeat an enemy without understanding their point of view.
Better yet, why don't you come To San Diego, and I can arrange a little tour of MCRD for ya, shaved head and all.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:43:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:32:42 (#)
Ranking: 2
Oh yeah? Berty?
My testes are 93 degrees fahrenheit!
take that!
-----------------------------------------------------------------
What's that in celsius?
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:32:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Oh yeah? Berty?
My testes are 93 degrees fahrenheit!
take that!
Submitted by Affinity (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:13:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
Submitted by cuberat (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:02:05 (#)
Ranking: 2
Even though I am totally against the war...I have to +2 this because it's the truth.
You fucking ungrateful eurotrash in western europe owe your very lives to us. If we wouldn't have bailed you out in WWII, bailed you out during the cold war etc.............
_____________________________________________________________________________________________
oooh, WWII, WWII. God almighty can't you quit that shit.
Yes thank you for WWII mighty America. Oh thanks also for Nuking Japan,
oh and murdering all those Vietnamese..........
To cite only selective historical acts in a contemporary debate, when
such historical acts are only representitive of a certain political
and economical epoch is sooooooooooo retarded it's untrue.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:11:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Who wouldn't kill to defend themselves? Who wouldn't kill to stay alive whilst assisting others make their lives better?
That's what a soldier is. You think they are heartless robots?
No way man.
They have a job to do, they do it well. Better than you or me I would guess.
They do it in the harshest conditions, with people trying to kill them, left and right.
Good lord man, if you can't see how good these people are, you are insane.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*shrugs*
That's the nature of the beast.
The point I was making was that there is a terrible cost in war, we must never forget that. How many soldiers have died? 2000 or so? Most of them Americans. How many iraqi's have died 100,000? 200,000? How many civil freedoms have been lost to the 'war on terror'? We must always be revolted when people like Mario are called to duty. That is our duty, in order to preserve the freedom that Mario desires to protect.
There is nothing laudable about war. The men and women who fight do their duty. They kill. They destroy. From time to time they build sewage treatment.
We must dissent Rad, we cannot allow ourselves to be caught up in the spectacle of war. We cannot allow ourselves to be blinded to the fact that these men and women do a dirty, appaling job. Especially in cases such as these. We must dissent. Or we shall lose far, far to much.
Submitted by c1ndy (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:08:52 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:08:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
What is this US you speak of?
I live in the First Republic of Earth, led by Emperor Jenkins.
Submitted by kai070169 (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:06:19 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Yes Rad, I know plenty, but you should learn US history from a non-US perspective, without the shit filters of US corporate culture. It ain't all cowboys & apple pies; US foreign policy has such potential for GOOD, it's maddening to see it perpetuate so many traggedies in the world, and sickening how self righteous Americans are when they get called on it.
On a side note, i doubt Iraq has the wherewithall to be a democratic nation on it's own, teh US should just officially occupy it as a US colony or something & go from there. This mess is just going to get worse.
Submitted by cuberat (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:02:05 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Even though I am totally against the war...I have to +2 this because it's the truth.
And to that cunt who said that Europe is going to kick our ass because of having to back us up all the time...You fucking ungrateful eurotrash in western europe owe your very lives to us. If we wouldn't have bailed you out in WWII, bailed you out during the cold war, and given you enough economic aid over the last 60 years to build you up to where you are, you would all be speaking German and/or Russian and working in forced labor camps or being systematically executed.
We saved your ass in the war. We gave you all the money to rebuild. We protected you in the Cold War. Now all you do is complain about us. Fuck, I don't like our politicians either. I said above I'm against the war. But why don't you people shut the fuck up and thank us for once like the people in Eastern Europe who know what its like to live under opression and foreign domination. We have helped them since the fall of the Iron Curtain and they are grateful.
Submitted by Affinity (user info) at 2005-06-07 14:00:35 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
+2 for passion
-1 for mis-directed loyalties
+1 for funny
keep it up soldier boy.
Remember you're working for humanity,
not the army or the states.......
just humanity
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:56:25 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
You ever learn about Iraq history, Kai, or just watch Fox news?
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:54:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Berty, dig this.
---------
One fact remains the same though Mario; you're a killer.
---------------------------
Who wouldn't kill to defend themselves? Who wouldn't kill to stay alive whilst assisting others make their lives better?
That's what a soldier is. You think they are heartless robots?
No way man.
They have a job to do, they do it well. Better than you or me I would guess.
They do it in the harshest conditions, with people trying to kill them, left and right.
Good lord man, if you can't see how good these people are, you are insane.
Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:52:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I can really let rip on this, but I'll take the high road.
Rock on, Mario.
Submitted by kai070169 (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:37:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
And fuck Iraq anyways. I wonder how many Timothy McVeigh clones are out there just waiting for a chance.....
Submitted by kai070169 (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:35:10 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by GodChicken (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:43:56 (#)
Ranking: 2
Are you out of your fucking mind? Maybe you should take a look at some of the video footage available. Iraq is most certainly a 3rd world country right now. It might not have been, if .005% of the population hadn't hoarded all the resources and cash for the last 50 years. They.are.fucked.
Yes, US meddling has caused a lot of problems, but it has not caused all of them. We're not the only ones who are in the middle east, nor are they former territories and colonies of ours.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iraq looks and functions like a 3rd world country because the USA used it as a puppet for decades & installed a nutjob named Saddam Hussein to run it - it never had a chance! You are so fucked, the very essence of why America is regarded as such a stupid country. ALL of the .005% you claim are the problem are the ones with the strongest ties to multinational corporations which control your country (or did you still believe in democracy too? NIGGA Please!).
Amreican people do plenty of good on the ground, but generally ALL PEOPLE do good in one way or another. But your government kills thousands of people every day with it's hostile foreign policies - don't you get it? you're a nation of violent killers spreading your disease everywhere you go. Why are you so indignant when people don't support the US agenda?
I can't think of a finer nation of PEOPLE than America - great folks, God blemm 'em all. But your government, Haliburton, general Electrics, Mobil Oil etc. have been out of control forever. When will it stop, so we can do some REAL humanitarian work on a GLOBAL scale, instead of running around patching self inflicted international wounds? USA will die the death of 1000 cuts when all your enemies decide to let you have it....
Normally I wouldn't care what other people do, but it's sad that US kids (soldiers) have to die because people want to make money. And that's what it's all about.
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:32:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
And I mean that in the nicest way, brotha apullo.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:32:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
This post scares me. British army soldiers are slightly different to US ones it seems. Ours are thugs with guns, it's how we train them to be. In the British army you go in cocky and young. Then they break you.
They remold you into a soldier, with the charachteristics that implies.
One fact remains the same though Mario; you're a killer. There are lovey dovey bit's to your job like civil engineering projects but your job is to fight and kill the enemy, whoever that may be. The people who decide that are the politicions, the people that tell you how are your CO's. You and your brothers in arms are tools of your country. Tools of your government. You knew that when you signed up and your proud to serve. Well done for you, I'm glad your happy. We need people like you, the job you do is neccesary.
What scares me is how quick you are to glorify you vocation. In this era of remote controlled death, it's important to remember what you do. You are a killer of men. Whenever you are sent to do your job, no matter how it may be justified and no matter how vital, it is a time of great sadness. There must always be outcry, indignation and horror at what you do, lest it becomes to acceptable and we lose touch with the terrible reality of war and death.
For what it's worth I support the war. Not because of a toppled dictatorship, but because of the oil. As long as the developed world order maintains it's stranglehold on the rest of the world there is stability, there is progress and, perhaps, the hope of raising man to a level beyond that which we currently inhabit.
I don't support the troops though. We musn't. Whenever I look at your picture, proud, noble and handsome in your uniform, I see a field of graves. It must always be this way Mario. You know why. It's nothing personal, far from it, your a good man. It is neccesity.
Submitted by rad1101 (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:31:52 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Nothing like bootstomping a retard, eh?
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:11:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Hairycoo, no I don't think that comment was a serious threat, but coming from someone like you, I would think you meant it as a realistic goal of the EU.
Main Entry: geno·cide
Pronunciation: 'je-n&-"sId
Function: noun
: the deliberate and systematic destruction of a racial or cultural group
I found a few other definitions where political groups were included in the definition, but I found nowhere where mass murder was included. Thanks for trying though.
I don't think America has a 100% innocent history, but you throwing around words you don't understand doesn't make America evil, it just shows your ignorance of history and the english language.
Submitted by badassmofo (user info) at 2005-06-07 13:04:18 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Some comments I posted from Apollo's post
"That said I am former military so it somewhat upsets me reading all these generalizations about Americans attitudes when it comes to apelike pounding of the chest. Our military works the way it does because the people below don't ask questions of the people above. We pride ourselves on our military, it's hereditary. The soldiers really don't make any decisions as to whether we go to war or not they just go when they are told. If those being told what to do didn't listen it would be similar to a company having to shut down because the employees had no morale. The American military uses the words honor, duty, fight for freedom and country as motivation."
"My point is 2 fold. First off the pay for an American soldier really isn't that great at all, and if you are single it's even worse. What I am saying is there is an underlying cause as to why an American joins the military and its pride. The pride is inherited from parents, grand parents, history and probably a few other sources. It's no different really than any other country being proud of their history. The feeling is less nowadays which kind of leads to my second point. I really don't hear the soldiers saying "we are heroes, honor us". The day in and day out soldier is no different really than you or I, and is probably plenty aware of the fact that other nations are pretty damn tired of hearing about America. What I do hear is a lot of media and political asshats calling for us to relish and enjoy the fact that we have overstepped our international boundaries by placing spotlight on our poor little soldier boys. Military shouldn't be held on some pedestal above all, but should sit right up there with policemen, firemen, and the like that risk their lives doing their jobs. That calls for something does it not?"
Submitted by hairycoo (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:52:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
ummm you took that comment seriously ?
yes thats right we are coming for you mate... all because I just said so. I have that power of course, I just float about Uber in my spare time in between revolutions. Yes its true we are coming for you - just like the terrorists, and the russians. what name will your propoganda machine have for us ? Im sure it will involve the word evil - seems to be a recurring theme that one.
Yes genocide.. umm let me check my dictionary.. umm , mass murder that will do - suck me
Submitted by badassmofo (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:52:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Wow my 10 minute interval is seriously screwed, you know going to lunch and all.
It seems baffling to me that people have this blind acceptance to what the media has to say. The MEDIA tells you to praise the US soldier and this equates to all soldiers being praise seeking mongers. Well holy shit it's a good thing we believe everything the media tells us. If not we'd be lost.
People join the military in the US for many reasons and probably least of which is because the have an illusion of being a HERO.
Seriously, I think there are some pretty intelligent people on UBer but come on. This generalization of the American attitude is absurd.
I joined the military partially because of family tradition, partially because of where I was mentally after high school I would have certainly dropped or failed out of college, and partially because even at 18 I knew I needed some discipline in my life.
Submitted by shark25 (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:49:22 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Just coming by to give a +2
Submitted by Jungle_Jimanee (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:47:09 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
"Guess what our job is in Iraq right now? It is to set up the infrastructure and then get the fuck out. I don't want to be there,"
You (ie America) are not going to leave, oh the Army will but the mercenaries protecting the oilfields won't. Will Iraq be allowed to sever trade relations with the US, no. So you won't leave.
Arms industry profits I have been told over the radio are at an all time high, I believe that that and the oil was the true goal.
You job out there right now is window dressing. That's one reality.
In another you are doing real good for the Iraqi people and you are helping them. But that is not the reason you are out there for, there are many other repressive regimes set up by America in need of desperate help, but America is not helping them.
"If you delve a little bit below the surface of what's being presented to you on television and in the papers, you'd see that there is much evidence that we are in fact doing our job well. "
I have done the delving, have you? I have also spoken with returning British soldiers, they are highly critical of the American Army system. The obvious brainwashing in most of those who claim US army connections is breathtaking. The "you bomb us, we bomb you" mentality, the catchall definition of everyone who opposes you as a "terrorist" or "Liberal fag". And yes there have been many posts and reviews on here and other sites with Marines, Soldiers and Republicans telling us that Marine = Respect.
"We don't want your pity, we just want your respect. We'll even settle for not being disrespected. Until given reason not to, I respect people. I don't think I'm better or worse than anyone else, we all do our own thing. But if you choose to insult the soldiers, please at least back it up with something. I'm open minded, if you have something grounded in fact to say, by all means, I'll listen. "
Those pictures of Marines abusing POWs (that had the potential of dragging us into WWIII), the stories from British soldiers of the American "Gung ho" attitude to war (that caused many friendly fire incidents during the Gulf conflict) and the Marines that I have spoken to with their brainwashed platitudes don't match the picture you paint.
There is something about Marine training that seems to remove the ability to admit error or to see another's point of view. I can see why America would find this necessary, but I can't respect it.
In fact there are very view institutions that I do respect, I respect you for what you have written but I cannot intrinsically respect Marines.
Submitted by GodChicken (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:43:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by kai070169 (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:32:40 (#)
Ranking: 0
You talk about Iraq like it's a 3rd world country - it's not, they have tons of cash & oil. You are not doing them any favors AT ALL. US meddling in arab affairs caused ALL these problems (YES including 9/11) so quit patting yourself on the back, and clean up the mess your parent, grand parents et. al, have left the world. As far as I can see, "buffoons" is an accurate assessment of US military intelligence, the biggest murderers on the planet.
===============================
BAHAHAHA!!!
Are you out of your fucking mind? Maybe you should take a look at some of the video footage available. Iraq is most certainly a 3rd world country right now. It might not have been, if .005% of the population hadn't hoarded all the resources and cash for the last 50 years. They.are.fucked.
Yes, US meddling has caused a lot of problems, but it has not caused all of them. We're not the only ones who are in the middle east, nor are they former territories and colonies of ours.
Maybe I will do a post about how intelligence works, because its obvious you do not have any idea.
Submitted by Shlongy (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:37:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
THIS POST SHOULD HAVE ALL +2's , you fucking cocksuckers.
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:36:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by hairycoo (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:07:01 (#)
Ranking: 0
just makes you all the more stupid to sign up in the first place.
you cant justify this 'giving back to my country' shit either. Not one of your wars on the last 60 years can be morally justified.... just mindless genocide, every fucking one of them.
Europe is coming back mother fucker - and once we can understand each other we are coming straight for you cunts - to get out own back for having to support you dipshits all of this time. We are going to destroy your world... not in a American style Nuclear attack , no fuck that we are going to take over and turn you into COMMUNISTS.. oh the irony.... then we would just sit back and laugh .. laugh so fucking much that you would hear the roar from across the Atlantic.
sweet.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Mindless genocide? Name one war in which the US attempted genocide. Do you even know what it means?
Yeah once the EU gets it's own constitution, decides not to back out of the Euro, and straightens everything out coming after America will be a great idea. I know we have opressed and attacked Europe so much, and we are such a huge threat to it. Great plan.
Submitted by kai070169 (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:32:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
You talk about Iraq like it's a 3rd world country - it's not, they have tons of cash & oil. You are not doing them any favors AT ALL. US meddling in arab affairs caused ALL these problems (YES including 9/11) so quit patting yourself on the back, and clean up the mess your parent, grand parents et. al, have left the world. As far as I can see, "buffoons" is an accurate assessment of US military intelligence, the biggest murderers on the planet.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:16:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I can sure as fuck justify Afghanistan. And as far as Iraq goes, regardless of my personal feelings on it, I'm going there to take care of my Joes.
Submitted by hairycoo (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:07:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
just makes you all the more stupid to sign up in the first place.
you cant justify this 'giving back to my country' shit either. Not one of your wars on the last 60 years can be morally justified.... just mindless genocide, every fucking one of them.
Europe is coming back mother fucker - and once we can understand each other we are coming straight for you cunts - to get out own back for having to support you dipshits all of this time. We are going to destroy your world... not in a American style Nuclear attack , no fuck that we are going to take over and turn you into COMMUNISTS.. oh the irony.... then we would just sit back and laugh .. laugh so fucking much that you would hear the roar from across the Atlantic.
sweet.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:06:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hahaha...I'm supposed to have a 135 IQ, but I think it's a bunch of crap. The tests were designed with the bias of their creators, and who said they're unfallable? Ooh, I can unscramble words and visualize shapes faster than average. I consider myself a grunt, pure and simple.
Submitted by Professional_Peon (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:03:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Well said, although I think you are a little off on your I.Q. calculations. I have a 148 and I'm a friggin idiot.
Submitted by paxlaurien (user info) at 2005-06-07 12:00:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
soldiers are the r0x0rs
Submitted by HadToBeDone (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:59:55 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
That is all true in times of war. How about the other years, when there is no combat and a whole lot of nothing to do? For career military, it all evens out....
Fuck it, I'm sick of everyone thinking their opinion counts for shit. We're all right, and yet we're all wrong.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:57:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hmm...I think it goes almost without saying that you'd have your SF tab or experience in a Ranger bat, some kind of special ops activity. After that, if I was going to try to be a mercenary, I'd dig up some info on Blackwater. Individuals also hire mercenaries as security forces/bodyguards. I don't know exactly what to do, but I think that's the gist of it. Maybe they'll take conventional forces too, who knows.
Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:50:35 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I've been there. I know the feeling.
How would somebody go about landing one of those mercenary gigs?
Submitted by Hadooken (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:39:26 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
that overpaid comment is bullshit. i live paycheck to paycheck scraping by. Whatever extra money i can pull together usually goes directly to pay off whatever debts i may have and occasionally, VERY rarely, i can get something nice for myself.
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:38:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by apollo88 (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:57:20 (#)
Ranking: 0
yes, to get a response.
like, i dunno, a warm, heated response.
my point, such as it was, was that ONLY AMERICAN SOLDIERS want constant BOO-YA KICK ASS praise.
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Can you show me anywhere an American Soilder said that. Can you show me anything that says most or even a group of american soilders said that? You seem to be too fucking dense to see the difference between putting military people on a pedestal and shitting on them.
Submitted by AshyLarry (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:32:51 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:27:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Tim, thanks man. I'll dig that info up for you.
Submitted by badassmofo (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:26:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
10 minutes = +2
The fact that someones job requires them to put thier life on the line, be it police, firemen, soldier, etc; deserves a certain amount of respect. Does it not?
Submitted by SiskelandFatboy (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:26:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
I am a fortune teller and my crystal ball tells me that this will vault into most heated by the end of business today.
Submitted by Hadooken (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:25:18 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I agree, I dont need people patting me on the back, I'll settle for not being spat on.
Submitted by MyNameIsTim (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:22:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
i don't know how anyone can not respect something like this.
i respect what you do. and what people like you do.
but i'm going to have to go ahead and disagree with :
His IQ (for all that's worth) is 145, which puts him about 15 points over being a certifiable genius. In fact, the average IQ in the special forces is just under 140. "Normal" Army soldiers also are very intelligent people, for the most part. Many have undergraduate degrees, quite a few have Masters or PhDs.
a) avg iq 140?
b) quote a few have masters or phds?
if you could produce some stats, i'd be impressed.
when i was looking at colleges, west point was very appealing to me. turns out because of a medical condition i was ineligable. i still think i'd enjoy being in service, and i wonder what it'd be like if in a few years i gave it a shot.
your post would do more than 10000 tv recruiting ads
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:18:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
GodChicken...very very well said.
Submitted by GodChicken (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:16:21 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
only part of what I wanted to say, but good nonetheless.
It isn't about praise, it's about respect.
We wear our praise as the rank on our shoulders and the ribbons/medals over our hearts.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:15:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Belle, we don't have to pay rent, the Army takes care of that. But even so, there are many many soldiers that still have to get food stamps to support their families. I'm lucky as hell being paid as much as I am. I don't think we're overpaid, its enough to be comfortable as an officer, but often times not as junior enlisted, which is what most of the soldiers are.
Submitted by shark25 (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:05:24 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by badassmofo (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:55:40 (#)
Ranking: 2
Mario - I am gonna come back every 10 minutes today and +2 this peice.
I spent some time on Apollo's post trying to say everything that you said here.
Good work and I can't wait to camp on this post for the rest of the day.
U.S. Army 95B '93 - '96
Hooah!
Submitted by shark25 (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:05:05 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I can feel the heat thru the force!
Submitted by hobbs (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:04:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
What the ghay?
Submitted by shark25 (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:03:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
This War = no reason for it.
Soldiers that fight and help rebuild = Good People.
All Media = Bias one way or another.
This post = +2.
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 11:02:30 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Good job with the most heated, you proved your point. But to reiterate, we generally DON'T WANT PRAISE. I'd be plum happy without it. And most people I know do great work at their jobs, whatever it may be. I'm sure you do well with whatever the fuck it is you do, Apollo. But I don't try to shit on it.
Submitted by Bellebrown (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:58:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I know that's not a lot, but do you have to pay rent or whatever? (food etc).
Submitted by Dervel (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:57:33 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Apollo, up until this point I've enjoyed a lot of the material you've written. After reading your most heated post, however, I feel you've been exposed for the utter tosser you are.
---
Ahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
If your looking for the ball, its behind you sunshine.
Submitted by apollo88 (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:57:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
yes, to get a response.
like, i dunno, a warm, heated response.
my point, such as it was, was that ONLY AMERICAN SOLDIERS want constant BOO-YA KICK ASS praise.
The rest just do their fucking JOB and shut the fuck up.
BUT MY MAJOR POINT was that I can get most heated quicker and for longer than whatthehell can. With ease.
i'm sure you work hard and do a good job (of fucking up the world) but then so do mcdonalds employees. go tie a ribbon for them.
Submitted by badassmofo (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:55:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Mario - I am gonna come back every 10 minutes today and +2 this peice.
I spent some time on Apollo's post trying to say everything that you said here.
Good work and I can't wait to camp on this post for the rest of the day.
U.S. Army 95B '93 - '96
Hooah!
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:54:22 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Yes, I'm paid. But you said we're overpaid, you twat.
Submitted by apollo88 (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:52:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
well, dur.
ARE YOU PAID MOTHERFUCKER??
ARE YOU?????
Submitted by Mario (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:52:07 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
The kid in the photo looks like my little brother.
Submitted by jgreening (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:49:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Well done.
Submitted by Scatherm (user info) at 2005-06-07 10:49:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
From one soldier to another, great post... very well-said.