Open letter to Islam in response to London Bombings (987 hits)
Category: NoneRating: 0.4 on 53 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by Cuberat (View user info) at 2005-07-08 17:11:54 EDT
Yesterday, after I arrived at work and heard of the London Bombings, I made a phone call to check on a friend who is traveling in the U.K. to make sure she was ok. While waiting for her to return my message (she eventually did letting me know she was no where near any of those places at the time), I sat down to pen a post reacting to the bombings.
After finishing it I promptly deleted it.
My reason was simple: I was pissed off, worried about my friend, and it was 8 am and I hadn't yet had my morning coffee. These factors, I figured, caused me to fly off on a rant which wasn't well thought out. I decided that if I still felt that way today, I would re-write the post more rationally.
That is what I am here to do.
I must preface all of this by saying that I am one of the most liberal people you will ever meet. I have voted straight Democrat my whole life (except for that one vote for Ralph Nader...) and most people feel that I am a long haired hippy trapped in a clean cut accountant's body. I am totally against the Iraq war, and totally anti-Bush.
That said, I have a surprising feeling in light of reflecting on the most recent terrorist attack:
I think that we haven't been hard enough on the Muslim/Arab world.
I mean really, I know that Bush has perpetrated one of the biggest, most atrocious scams in history in Iraq. I realize that centuries of crusades, ignoring or colonizing areas of the world, and economic domination are terrible things western nations have inflicted on Arab culture.
But what right does that give them to keep committing acts like these against our people?
There are those that will say that these acts are committed by fundamentalists who do not conform to mainstream Islam. Many point out that Islam is a peaceful religion with tenets similar to Christianity and Judaism which respect life and promote peace, love, and harmony.
Those are all well and good, and I believe those people. But I feel that they are still full of shit for thinking that only the fundamentalists are responsible.
Islam by its very definition has a violent and militaristic element not present in its sister religions of Christianity or Judaism. That being that the Koran promotes Jihad (holy war). Sure us Christians had the Crusades, and the Old Testament of the Bible tells of the Jews fighting wars to obtain the Holy Land, but I challenge any one to point out the passage in the Bible that encourages us to forcefully convert the world to our religion, or to wage holy war in the name of forcing people to change their ways.
The reason Christianity and Judaism have some corrupt history in the areas of wars and conversion, is because of the orders of its human leaders, its human organization. Islam has less of an excuse because its very scripture encourages such action.
In addition to the Koranic element, I ask the question: "What have moderate/mainstream Muslims done to counteract the fundamentalists?"
I see very little happening in that department - in fact I would venture to say that mainstream Islam silently supports the terrorism perpetrated by the fundamentalists.
What concrete actions have you seen to refute my above statement? Other than a few world leaders offering condolences...nothing. I did however see Palestinians dancing in the street to celebrate the U.S. tragedy on 9/11/2001. I read web reactions praising Allah in response to the London Bombings on 7/7/2005.
I have one thing to say to the Muslim world in response to what I have deduced above:
Watch your ass.
Eventually those of us in the west, no matter how liberal or peaceloving, or appreciative of other cultures we are, we will get fed up with this shit.
Imagine for a moment, if you will, what would happen if the politically dissident populations of places like the U.S., U.K. and Isreal were to get fed up with the terrorism and lack of action against terrorism in the Islamic world.
It would be like letting a rabid pit bull off a leash.
You think our interference in the Middle East is bad now? Wait until the U.S. lets the Mossad (Israel's CIA) off of its leash. They have plenty of tactics to fight terror which we don't let them freely use...they could probably wipe out terrorism in a month if we let them loose...but we don't to protect civil rights and innocent lives in the Arab world.
Think what would happen if we were to start fighting you the way you fight us...picture a few small nuclear devices going off in the middle of Mecca during the annual Hajj (Muslim Pilgrimage to their holiest shrine).
We could also easily bar all Muslims access to Jerusalem (just as holy to you as to us). Or bomb the shit out of all of your countries until you submit.
Hell if we got fed up enough, we could probably re-colonize all of your countries and kill off or forcibly convert your whole populations.
I doubt it will ever come to that point. Hell for both of our sakes, I pray it never does. But if you don't rein in your fundamentalists soon, more shit is going to hit the fan.
And shit hitting the fan has a tendency to snowball. So lend us a hand here.
It just gets harder for us to rein in our fundamentalists when yours do shit like this. All I'm asking for is more of a response than "We condemn these attacks and send our condolences". You probably know where Bin Laden is, how about handing him over? What about turning over the next bombing cell before it happens?
If you try harder, we can try harder.
User Reviews
Submitted by alex.lifeson (user info) at 2005-07-25 21:02:46 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Not a very smart idea to start referring to terrorists in general as "the muslim world". The reason some people decided to kill a couple thousand people isn't because they have brown skin, or because of their religion. It's more of an issue of major problems in their heads, which could happen to anyone in the world just as easily. You seem to think that because you saw footage of brown-skinned people celebrating 9/11, all people who are brown skinned and muslim must support killing thousands of people. A little tip: don't think you know what the overall attitude towards terrorism is in the middle east because of a couple shots you saw on tv, shots specifically selected by whoever put together the news, so it would make a good story and people would watch the show.
Submitted by DCWoody (user info) at 2005-07-09 17:10:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Title-4
post-6
-6--4=-2
Uber has strange maths
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-09 09:23:07 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I mean, Danger_Ranger couldn't bring thorpe and williamson over for a visit to Texas....
-----------------
Hahahaha. +2 for that.
Submitted by MrWillard (user info) at 2005-07-09 08:38:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by charminglybeef (user info) at 2005-07-09 06:00:36 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
The author's attempt to minimize the dedication of the world's Muslims to global peace is to ignore the outcries and disgust of almost 1.5 billion people worldwide. As does the notion that murdering millions of people is an acceptable resolution. The very suggestion demonstrates an incapacity to empathize. The same incapacity demonstrated so overtly by those who carried out these attacks and by those who preach death as the answer.
With a good pair of eyes it's plain to see the disproportionate amount of suffering endured by Muslims in the modern world, particularly the Middle East.
-WTC Civilian Casualties: 2,819
-Iraq War Civilian casualties: 20,000+
It's also plain to see that numbers like that and rhetoric like this are the spawn of such acts in the first place.
A few interesting questions hide beneath your ignorant and mis-guided plea or threat or whatever it was.
Submitted by doctorj24 (user info) at 2005-07-09 01:35:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Go Christianity! Woooo!
Submitted by AndraSidan (user info) at 2005-07-09 01:15:49 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Chinaski (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:21:06 (#)
Ranking: -1
In response to a few of the responses I've seen below, I want to know- who here is actually retarded enough to think some shit like God actually spoke to Moses and issued some commands? Are you fucking retarded? You guys actually think there's some big beneficial DAD up in the SKY? Who actually thinks "God" changed his mind between the new and old testament and decided to treat humans differently? Is god an omnipotent retard? I mean, for christ's sakes, I can't believe people actually believe in this fairy tale. Insipid stupidity is so tiresome.
---------------------------------------------------------
Yea, it is.
Submitted by AndraSidan (user info) at 2005-07-09 01:14:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Since when were we talking about homosexuality?
Submitted by HadToBeDone (user info) at 2005-07-09 00:23:19 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by AndraSidan (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:19:43 (#)
Ranking: 2
The Old Testament and Koran are similar, the New Testament and the Koran are not. The Old Testament must be read hermeneutically; there is a reason Christians speak of an old covenant and a new covenant. That reason is a change in God ways of dealing with man. The Christianity of today is not based in the Old Testament; it's foundation lies in the New
---------------
They only use the Old Testament when proclaiming that gays are violating God's Law and trying to outlaw homosexuality. Or have you forgotten that Bush, his good Christian self, actually tried to argue that Texas sodomy laws which barred consensual buttsex between adults wasn't unconstitutional?
I mean, Danger_Ranger couldn't bring thorpe and williamson over for a visit to Texas....
Submitted by Unabonger (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:45:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
it's a matter of money and technology. christians in the west have the guns. go back and reverse the roles and you'd see christian fundamentalists bombing train stations in Iraq. then you'd see Iraq silently hold nukes over the rest of the world. can you seriously blame them for not fighting us traditionally? a bomb that kills 5 civilians says alot more to the world than killing 200 soldiers on a battlefield. i, in no way, support or condone the actions taken by the terrorists from another country but we have terrorists in ours too...they're just being watched more closely. And the wack-jobs on the internet suggesting to blow the shit out of the Middle East are lazy fucking americans and aren't out robbing a nuke from our military and sneaking it into Mecca. our people are too lazy and not determined enough for that shit.
who the hell knows, maybe turning the entire fucking corner of the world into a mushroom cloud is the solution. it's certainly more radical than any other suggestion and what we're doing now is just not working. i think it's unfortunate that they kill civilians and we can't (purposefully), but that's what being the bigger man is all about, right? isn't that one of those reasons that we're supposed to be a great country? i'd hate to live in a country run by people who throw the switch and kill innocent people to get a point across.
but, though i don't agree with you, i can see your point of view. and i just got a mean blowjob so here's a +2.
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:25:56 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
http://www.ubersite.com/m/39437 Yes, Wiggles. You're the nutjob who vandalizes bibles in hotels.
-----------
Well, I'm sorry if I put a little ink in approximately three motel Bibles across my state. I will cheerfully pledge to never tamper with sacred Christian text again if you will give a sincere, non-smartass apology to Tom. But I know you won't do that, and if you did, it probably wouldn't be sincere.
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:21:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Wiggles, do you know the history of Islam and how it was spread by the sword? Of course you probably don't because you get all your information from Islam apologist websites.
Of course you probably don't know that muslims are also supposed to follow the Hadith collections as if they were part of the quran itself. That means that these lying frauds can say "The quran says THIS and it is peaceful" and leave out the parts that are violent and intolerant in a text held as high as their holy book. Fuck muslims, honestly. The peaceful ones need to reign in their loose cannons or fuck' em all to hell and anthrax the whole lot of em'.
------------
Stabkill, there is a world of information that actually exists <gasp> OUTSIDE THE INTERNET. It's called education. Where did you go to school? What kind of classes did you take?
I don't like to pick on you, because believe it or not, I have some respect for your military service, no matter the cause. But your military background has probably kept you from taking an objective look at anything, and the "good versus evil" scenario is too comfortable for you to simply let go of. I've seen it in so many people, and although I know you won't admit it, I'm almost certain you've got a standard case.
Read some books. Keep reading them even if you disagree with them. In fact, keep reading them BECAUSE you disagree with them. Pay less attention to the bestseller trash that Michael Moore and Bill O'Reilly and Matt Drudge put out, and read some actual history. I don't claim to be any sort of expert on world religions, but I've read and studied enough to be able to skim through the hype and propaganda.
Submitted by Chinaski (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:21:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
In response to a few of the responses I've seen below, I want to know- who here is actually retarded enough to think some shit like God actually spoke to Moses and issued some commands? Are you fucking retarded? You guys actually think there's some big beneficial DAD up in the SKY? Who actually thinks "God" changed his mind between the new and old testament and decided to treat humans differently? Is god an omnipotent retard? I mean, for christ's sakes, I can't believe people actually believe in this fairy tale. Insipid stupidity is so tiresome.
Submitted by TheEvilleprechaun (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:20:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
this is so logically bullshit i cant believe it. christians dont believe everything in the bible, if they did, they would be scary as fuck, or way scarier then they are now. so why do muslims have to adhere to everything the koran says, why do we categorize the Middle east as muslim (im not saying the majority isnt muslim, just that your confusing nations and religions), and why cant, on a personal level, all religions be peaceful? even if the koran advocates holy war, the bible advocates some pretty weir shit too, an most people just ignore it. why cant most muslims do the same thing, as they are doing now?
Submitted by Chinaski (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:17:47 EDT (#)
Ranking: -1
How do you know the US and English governments aren't silently or not-so-silently perpetrating this shit to meet their own ends? I mean, if they did 9-11, which they obviously did, they could have done this London shit too, to coincide with the G8 summit and push through what every criminal rich protectionist shit they want to push.
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 23:02:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
http://www.ubersite.com/m/39437 Yes, Wiggles. You're the nutjob who vandalizes bibles in hotels.
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:53:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Wiggles... Why the fuck not go back to when the Brits were starving the Irish also and act like it applies to today. Or how about even further? Fuckin' Columbus. He's a fucking bastard. SPAIN is the root of all evil.
Wiggles, do you know the history of Islam and how it was spread by the sword? Of course you probably don't because you get all your information from Islam apologist websites.
Of course you probably don't know that muslims are also supposed to follow the Hadith collections as if they were part of the quran itself. That means that these lying frauds can say "The quran says THIS and it is peaceful" and leave out the parts that are violent and intolerant in a text held as high as their holy book. Fuck muslims, honestly. The peaceful ones need to reign in their loose cannons or fuck' em all to hell and anthrax the whole lot of em'.
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:45:13 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
So what the fuck do all you people think about Comicbookguy?!?!
Submitted by Genko (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:38:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
"But Bill and Tammy aren't the only Christians in the world, and if you go back a few hundred years..."
...then you're a few hundred years into the past. Try basing your arguments on current information. The people who ran the Spanish Inqusition are dead, dumbass.
Submitted by sg11588 (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:35:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Stabkill, I did not side with any religion nor was my statement about any religion. I was simply stating that you can't blame people (and those people just happen to be Muslims) for something that a minority of people do.
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:32:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
When a lot of people say "Christians", they think of Bill and Tammy from the suburbs, with 2.5 kids, a big screen TV and a swimming pool. But Bill and Tammy aren't the only Christians in the world, and if you go back a few hundred years...
Fuck this post. I'm sick of arguing this shit. Go to a library for a few years, and then come back and post this again.
Free your mind...
...and your ass will follow.
Submitted by williamson (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:29:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
"I see very little happening in that department - in fact I would venture to say that mainstream Islam silently supports the terrorism perpetrated by the fundamentalists."
-- Agreed.
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:23:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
The Old Testament and Koran are similar, the New Testament and the Koran are not. The Old Testament must be read hermeneutically; there is a reason Christians speak of an old covenant and a new covenant. That reason is a change in God ways of dealing with man. The Christianity of today is not based in the Old Testament; it's foundation lies in the New, which never preaches violence in the name of converstion (or anything else for that matter). In violent content (such as what cuberat was referring to) it is in no way similar to Islam.
I'm not defending religiosity, I am simply pointing out that there are vast differences between the two religions and only the ignorant or purposefully blind claim otherwise.
---------------
So Christians stopped all violent crimes after the New Testament was put out?
And I'm guessing you've never actually read the Koran, have you?
I'm not defending Muslims or terrorists. I'm saying that Christians have done the exact same things in the past, and that both religions are equally capable of senseless violence, especially when they aren't the dominant culture in the world.
Humans are humans. When you look at them on a global scale, it doesn't matter what their religion is. They are going to re-interpret their religion in order to fulfill their desires as humans, not as "Christians" or "Muslims".
Submitted by Sphagnum (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:11:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I don't agree with any of your sentiments here.
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 22:02:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:28:59 (#)
Ranking: 2
Good ole wiggles equating islam to christianity again. Yep...both are the same, no matter what you see/hear on the news...right wiggles?
Oh yeah... Please explain the differences between Jesus Christ and Mohammed. One spread the "word of god" by peace, the other by war. Hint: Mohammed was a murderous pedophile.
Now go love Islam, Wiggles.
----------------
Sorry, Stabkill. I'd love to debate ya, but you lost all your credibility when you started an internet insult match against a nice 16-year-old who had just lost his father to a terrible accident. You're a sick person, and I don't mean that as an insult. There's something seriously wrong with you, deep inside.
And judging by this, http://www.ubersite.com/m/55557 you're a stubborn fuck, as well. You don't admit when you're wrong, and that's what seperates nice guys like Rad from nutcases like yourself.
I'm glad you made some buddies at Ubercon. Now go get a real education, take your head out of the Drudge report, and most importantly, calm the fuck down.
I feel sorry for you, dude.
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2005-07-08 21:11:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:35:57 (#)
Ranking: 2
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:24:00 (#)
Ranking: -2
years of crusades? what western countries have inflicted on muslim countries? Ever even heard of Suleiman the Magnificent? The many, many muslim invasions of europe?
that aside, your letter was brilliant and insightful, I'm sure all the members of ubersite who are al-qaeda have read it and totally changed their point of view based on your open letter
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And another person that failed to read the post... Of course Christians did things like the crusades and the spanish inquisition... THe author noted that. He also noted that it was directed by people, not the bible. Islam, on the other hand, is violent BECAUSE of its word...
_______________________________________________________________--
And another person that slept through his history classes. I was merely pointing out that muslim countries were not innocent of the charge of aggression, that for every Crusade muslim armies more then repaid in kind. Read the reply. Or did you think Suleiman was a european name?
Submitted by zakalwe (user info) at 2005-07-08 20:53:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
not been following the news today, but aren't you jumping the gun a bit by assuming it was Islamic terrorists for sure? last I heard, that claim of responsibility was still in doubt.
Submitted by jimthefiend (user info) at 2005-07-08 20:34:52 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I normally throw things at hippys. But I'm kinda liking you.
The ability to think for ones own self is to be admired.
Submitted by cuberat (user info) at 2005-07-08 20:15:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Rainer: As others have stated in the reviews, if you would have read the whole thing, I addressed your point regarding Christianity. As far as non-extremist Muslims, I just don't see their governments or clerics, or anyone else taking a strong stand or concrete measures against this kind of terrorism.
ScoobyDont: On the contrary to your point about no one in the USA trying to counteract Bush and his brand of religious fanaticism, I know I for one was out there trying to get Kerry elected just for the fact that we could get Bush OUT of the White House. I campaigned for him and Obama and all the other Democrats running for office where I live. I'm not saying the Democratic Party is the absolute answer, I'm just saying they are the best option we have right now.
Also, if you recall, only like 51% of the country voted for Bush...I would say that about half the country was trying to do something about religious extremism in our country.
Zoidberg: I am aware of the history you cited, that the Muslims invaded Europe on more than one occasion. That merely strengthens my argument. If you look at the world, very few places where Islam took root are stable today, most are war torn or in shambles. However, where other religions or cultures flourish there is an element of stability. I realize this excludes places which are unstable and not Islamic, but there are other explanations for these places if you look at history or culture.
Submitted by AndraSidan (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:42:19 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Rainer (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:13:54 (#)
Ranking: -2
I couldn't read more than the first couple paragraphs of this.
Christians don't try to convert the world to our religion? What do you call what happened in the 1700's? Christians don't promote violence? Bush won largely because of the Christian vote, most of which supported the war. Look at the Crusades.
---------------------------------------------------------------
In the 1700's, if you get your history correct, PEACEFULL revivals took place. What history book have you been reading? How could you find it accurate to compare Jon Edwards preaching to 20,000 Americans who chose to be there with an army using whatever religion was close enough to muster forces and attack the wealth of the Muslims? Misguided fervor and greed caused the crusades, not Christianity.
You must also realize that the vast majority of Christians who support the war (I've seen enough of them to know) support it not because of an unquenchable bloodlust but a desire for justice. They rationalize the war in the same way they rationalize using force to defend their homes from a burglar. I don't necessarily agree with the war but to portray Christians as war hungry followers of a violent religion is just stupid. That and connecting American protestant Christianity with the crusades is easily as extreme as the ideology the led to the crusades themselves.
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:40:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
sg11588 added to the list of fools... I guess the fucker doesn't watch television or read papers (from multiple sources) to hear alot of words that sound a hell of alot like the average muslim siding with the terrorists...
Of course, Muslims hate jews and so do die-hard leftist liberal democrats.
I think that's how you can tell if someone is fucking worthless: Ask them what they think about Israel and if they go on a fucking tirade, they are worthless. If they have merely "concern" they are fine.
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:35:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:24:00 (#)
Ranking: -2
years of crusades? what western countries have inflicted on muslim countries? Ever even heard of Suleiman the Magnificent? The many, many muslim invasions of europe?
that aside, your letter was brilliant and insightful, I'm sure all the members of ubersite who are al-qaeda have read it and totally changed their point of view based on your open letter
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And another person that failed to read the post... Of course Christians did things like the crusades and the spanish inquisition... THe author noted that. He also noted that it was directed by people, not the bible. Islam, on the other hand, is violent BECAUSE of its word...
Sure, the bible says to beat your children to keep them in line and it is OK to keep slaves, but is there a passage to hunt down "infidels - AKA non-muslims" to the ends of the earth?
I dislike most religions myself, but Islam is the shittiest, lowest, worthless feces scribbled on paper ever. And then you got people who are the diehard liberals who hate christians sucking muslim cock. I don't understand...they hate you more than anyone. This post made sense.
Liberals are not all fools, but the ones who ignore real threats are. Of course, maybe these guys like women being treated as property instead of humans, and like sharia law.
Submitted by sg11588 (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:35:44 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Sorry, the KKK is a better example than Timothy McVeigh.
Submitted by sg11588 (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:34:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Sorry, but you think it is easy for the Islamic people to stop the extremists? And you think the extremists will listen to them? Blaming the entire Muslim population for what radical Muslims do is like blaming every white Christian for what Timothy McVeigh did. You are a moron.
Submitted by Stabkill (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:28:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Good ole wiggles equating islam to christianity again. Yep...both are the same, no matter what you see/hear on the news...right wiggles?
Oh yeah... Please explain the differences between Jesus Christ and Mohammed. One spread the "word of god" by peace, the other by war. Hint: Mohammed was a murderous pedophile.
Now go love Islam, Wiggles.
Submitted by AndraSidan (user info) at 2005-07-08 19:19:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:42:37 (#)
Ranking: -2
Comparing Islam to Christianity is like comparing oranges to very similar oranges.
The Bible and Koran are just about equally violent, and each can be interpreted to advocate radical acts of violence.
------------------------------------
The Old Testament and Koran are similar, the New Testament and the Koran are not. The Old Testament must be read hermeneutically; there is a reason Christians speak of an old covenant and a new covenant. That reason is a change in God ways of dealing with man. The Christianity of today is not based in the Old Testament; it's foundation lies in the New, which never preaches violence in the name of converstion (or anything else for that matter). In violent content (such as what cuberat was referring to) it is in no way similar to Islam.
I'm not defending religiosity, I am simply pointing out that there are vast differences between the two religions and only the ignorant or purposefully blind claim otherwise.
Submitted by MrSparkle847 (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:49:54 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
I think that we haven't been hard enough on the Muslim/Arab world.
_________________________
You thought wrong. The Muslim/Arab world doesn't build the bombs, nor do they detonate them. They may spawn the psychos who do, but all the same, the German world spawned Hitler, the English world spawned Jack The Ripper, and the American world spawned Clinton. Do we persecute any of them?
Submitted by Wiggles (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:42:37 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Comparing Islam to Christianity is like comparing oranges to very similar oranges.
The Bible and Koran are just about equally violent, and each can be interpreted to advocate radical acts of violence.
Submitted by Tinglydwarf (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:28:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Damn straight
Submitted by Zoidberg (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:24:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
years of crusades? what western countries have inflicted on muslim countries? Ever even heard of Suleiman the Magnificent? The many, many muslim invasions of europe?
that aside, your letter was brilliant and insightful, I'm sure all the members of ubersite who are al-qaeda have read it and totally changed their point of view based on your open letter
Submitted by JonnyX (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:21:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
one word.
bioplague.
Submitted by ScoobyDont (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:19:04 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I would ask, what have Americans done to counteract George Bush and religious fanaticism in this country? We are being led into the next round of the Crusades and we are standing around waving guns screaming for blood and smiling for photo ops.
We somehow gained the status of "world police", maybe with the Monroe Doctrine, but it is now in the hands of the insane extremists that we were once trying to protect the world from. We can't even police our own country. This is no utopia.
Religious extremism cannot be fought with religious extremism, but no one here is doing anything about it. The thugs in this country also wear robes and talk a lot of crap, but they are called the court. They fist waving suits need to be silenced just like the leaders of terror cells, because that's what they are.
Submitted by Rainer (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:13:54 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
I couldn't read more than the first couple paragraphs of this.
Christians don't try to convert the world to our religion? What do you call what happened in the 1700's? Christians don't promote violence? Bush won largely because of the Christian vote, most of which supported the war. Look at the Crusades.
What the fuck do you want the non-extremist Muslims to do? Would you like to gather them all up, put them on TV and make them all say they're sorry?
Get off your soap box, don't condemn an entire religion because of a few douche-rockets. If that's how things are done, I'd nuke Christians, because they're a helluvalot dumber than any Muslim I've ever seen.
Submitted by notyou (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:12:46 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Axolotl (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:36:45 (#)
Ranking: 2
I have the feeling that we're going to invade Iran...
---------------------------
But the women are just now able to play golf on its one golf course. They would be sad.
http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/world/3252521
Submitted by RandytheHelpfulPineapple (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:01:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I disagree on some things, but for the most part I agree. Americans don't like to lose, we're stubborn sons of bitches. Every time something like this happens, it's like tickling a sleeping dragon's tail --not smart and regretable if the shit does hit the fan.
We really need some sort of Islamic MLK to teach these guys the benefits of proper protest. I can only imagine the media shit storm if Iraqi's came together in a peaceful demonstration and told our troops to get out. That'd put us in our place, because if we stay it we're the ones repressing a free democratic people. This would cause huge outcry by the American people --but it will never happen.
The problem is a major populist belief is that fighting is a solution ordained by Allah, and Clerics in the religion use populist opinion to gain status like Roman Senators over there. Take Al-Sadr for instance... he was a nobody, small time Cleric until he refused to be detained, and sparked a bloody revolt.
I totally agree with you that the chain holding back many American's is bound to break eventually. If you mess with the bull you get the horns. Apropos.
Submitted by strider (user info) at 2005-07-08 18:00:01 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Yes Comment
Submitted by EatMeCompletely (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:59:24 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
There are times when I question the actions of man as a whole. Then, there are times when I question the actions of a specific group. You are right. These people fight with the strength of a million cowards, hiding in a dark place, biding their time until it appears no one's watching, only to attack and vanish.
It's a goddamn shame that no one will adhere to conventional warfare. Maybe, I know this sounds real progressive, people could try not to kill each other for a change.
Submitted by spamtrap50 (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:44:02 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I'm with you dude...I'm also pretty liberal, but when push comes to shove we should shove with a nuke or two (preferable BEFORE Iran gets one).
Submitted by Axolotl (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:36:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I have the feeling that we're going to invade Iran...
...and I also have the feeling that the draft will be starting up again in Bush's 2nd term.
Or if not, the army will be so depopulated that the guy after Bush, Republican or Democrat, will have to fix Bush's mistakes by instituting conscription, and he'll be the guy to blame.
Looks like we're goin' off to fight the Ayatollahs soon, Ubersite...
Submitted by Genko (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:34:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I've been rambling on for years about how we should turn the middle east into a giant glass parking lot.
Of course, I'm usually drunk. Anyone with such an extremist additude would have to be.
...oh, wait.
Submitted by loki (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:20:39 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Anyone who thinks that their way is the only way is dangerous.
Submitted by cuberat (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:16:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Hadtobedone:
You obviously didn't read the very next paragraph where I said that it was done by Christians as a result of our corruptable human leadership as opposed to Islam where it is written into their scripture.
Submitted by HadToBeDone (user info) at 2005-07-08 17:14:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Sure us Christians had the Crusades, and the Old Testament of the Bible tells of the Jews fighting wars to obtain the Holy Land, but I challenge any one to point out the passage in the Bible that encourages us to forcefully convert the world to our religion, or to wage holy war in the name of forcing people to change their ways.
-------------
It ain't in the Bible, but you Christian fuckers do it anyway.