Because ETS gave me a shitload to read yesterday (618 hits)
Category: NoneRating: 1.25 on 46 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by DrSeussman (View user info) at 2006-10-12 11:33:36 EDT
I give him this, have fun ETS!
If everyone wants to vote fine, but really I would love to see a completely neutral post for once.
http://www.progressive.org/mag_mc100406?cheney (article below)
Criticizing Cheney to His Face Is Assault?
By Matthew Rothschild
October 4, 2006
Steve Howards says he used to fantasize about what he'd say to President Bush or Vice President Cheney if he ever got the chance.
That opportunity arrived on June 16, the same day he says he read about U.S. fatalities in Iraq reaching 2,500.
"Initially, I walked past him. Then I said to myself, 'I can't in good conscience let this opportunity pass by.' So I approached him, I got about two feet away, and I said in a very calm tone of voice, 'Your policies in Iraq are reprehensible.'"
Howards says he was taking two of his kids to their Suzuki piano camp in Beaver Creek, Colorado. They were walking across the outdoor public mall area when all of a sudden he saw Cheney there.
"I didn't even know he was in town," Howards says. "He was walking through the area shaking hands. Initially, I walked past him. Then I said to myself, 'I can't in good conscience let this opportunity pass by.' So I approached him, I got about two feet away, and I said in a very calm tone of voice, 'Your policies in Iraq are reprehensible.' And then I walked away."
Howards says he knew the Administration has a "history of making problems" for people who protest its policies, so he wanted to leave off at that.
But the Secret Service did not take kindly to his comment."About ten minutes later, I came back through the mall with my eight-year-old son in tow," Howards recalls, "and this Secret Service man came out of the shadows, and his exact words were, 'Did you assault the Vice President?' "
Here's how Howards says he responded: "No, but I did tell Mr. Cheney the way I felt about the war in Iraq, and if Mr. Cheney wants to be shielded from public criticism, he should avoid public places. If exercising my constitutional rights to free speech is against the law, then you should arrest me."
Which is just what the agent, Virgil D. "Gus" Reichle Jr, proceeded to do.
"He grabbed me and cuffed my hands behind my back in the presence of my eight-year-old son and told me I was being charged with assault of the Vice President,"Howards recalls.
He says he told the agent, "I can't abandon my eight-year-old son in a public mall."
According to Howards, Reichle responded: "We'll call Social Services." Before that could happen, however, "my son ran away and found my wife," who was nearby, Howards says.
"First of all, I was scared," Howard recalls. "They wouldn't tell my wife where they were taking me. Second of all, I was incredulous this could be happening in the United States of America. This is what I read about happening in Tiananmen Square. They hauled me away to Eagle County jail and kept me with my hands cuffed behind my back for three hours."
At the jail, the charge against him was reduced to harassment, he says, and he was released on $500 bond. The Eagle County DA's office eventually dropped that charge.
On October 3, Howards sued Reichle for depriving him of his First Amendment right of free speech and his Fourth Amendment right to be protected from illegal seizure.
Howards and his attorney, David Lane, have not demanded a specific dollar amount.
"We will go to trial and let a Colorado jury decide what type of damages are appropriate," says Howards. "This isn't about anything I did. This about what I said. There is a frontal assault occurring on our constitutional right to free speech. We brought this suit because of our belief that this Administration's attempt to suppress free speech is a greater threat to the long-term integrity of this nation than ten Osama bin Ladens."
Reichle did not return my call for comment. Nor did he respond to The New York Times in its article on this incident.
Lon Garner, special agent in charge at the Secret Service's Denver office, says he has "no reaction" to the lawsuit. "It's in litigation," he says. "We have no comment."
Before his encounter with Cheney, Howards says he had a clean record.
"I was never arrested before," he says. "I don't have so much as a speeding ticket."
GIS for Dick Cheney is a dick....
User Reviews
Submitted by kybernetikum (user info) at 2006-10-12 20:51:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
Über-masturbation
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 20:39:04 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2006-10-12 18:30:55 (#)
Ranking: -2
BOOOOO!
Way to post twice in one day. See when you do that your OTHER post gets dropped. Grrrrrr.
I had a good scrap brewin' here, jackass.
>pouts<
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Sorry man, but you an Indoninja needed a time out!
Submitted by electrictoothsyndrome (user info) at 2006-10-12 18:56:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Seen it.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2006-10-12 18:30:55 EDT (#)
Ranking: -2
BOOOOO!
Way to post twice in one day. See when you do that your OTHER post gets dropped. Grrrrrr.
I had a good scrap brewin' here, jackass.
>pouts<
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2006-10-12 17:33:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 15:52:43 (#)
Ranking: 2
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You are an ignorant cunt.
I didn't say it justifies a steady decline in liberty (and an isolated incident like this hardly signifies one). I said it was an inexcusable act, that will likely end that guys career (as it probably should) but it is hardly then end of freedom in the US or a symptom of eroding freedom.
It was an overzealous secret service agent, not an attack on your freedom of speech. I am sure he isn't the first or last "security" type person who has overstepped their bounds. The worst thing about this isn't that some guy was arrested for no reason, the worst thing is that the Secret service agent who should be very highly trained was so out of line.
What is tragic is your joy at jumping to conclusions and pointing your finger at "solid evidence" that we are losing our freedom of speech, but fail to see how much more openly acceptable it is to mock the Govt on TV, radio, internet whatever medium you can think of then ever before.
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Oh indo... good to see yer just as silly as always.
It just so happens that I HAVE been known to be rather ignorant at times... and fairly cuntish.
But you?
heh.
See, your tactics for engaging in any sort of conversation / argument are so painfully distractive and lathered in conjecture that you just end up frustrating the fuck out of anyone unlucky enough to line up on the opposite side of whatever issue you happen to be ignorantly defending with your tunnel-vision stupidity.
I particularly like how you keep bringing up "the end of freedom in the US" - like that is something that I (or anyone else) is ultimately implying. Stop being such a melodramatic retard and try being honest enough with yourself to acknowledge the fact that America is slowly compromising established citizen rights in lieu of a false sense of security. This is not sensationalized nonsense, it is an observation based on very definitive empirical data. The Patriot act is a perfect example of this... yet it never receives the sort of critical examination it deserves because what the fuck is the point? We have all given far too much power to governments and corporations in our detached apathy and we lack the ability to muster up any tangible outrage at this utter garbage that goes on each and every day. "What can I do?" is asked far too often by people who are already convinced that the answer is "absolutely nothing".
Luckily we are constantly being bombarded with the notion that "it's really not all that bad" from ignorant assholes just like you - so we can all feel better about how only marginally fucked up the world is and continue to keep up our record levels of consumerism and other wasteful destructive bullshit antics we keep ourselves selfishly entertained with.
Well fuck that. Fuck you. It IS that bad - and just because it hasn't gotten apocalyptic yet doesn't mean that things are "just fine."
Smart, educated people like yourself continually disappoint me. Your willingness to suspend rational big-picture thinking in exchange for some temporary blissful ignorance is not only irritating but its ultimately damaging to humanity. Thanks a lot, dipshit.
Mocking the laughable state of the world and our tragically inefficient governments is a pretty unsatisfying outlet for the distain I have for how fucking stupid we have become as a society.
But it will do, for now.
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 15:52:43 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2006-10-12 14:45:31 (#)
Ranking: 2
Oh, and I am also astounded that Indoninja actually justifies the steady decline of the American standard for freedom and liberty by heralding the fact that this guy can now sue.
That is fucking fantastic. (read: tragic.)
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You are an ignorant cunt.
I didn't say it justifies a steady decline in liberty (and an isolated incident like this hardly signifies one). I said it was an inexcusable act, that will likely end that guys career (as it probably should) but it is hardly then end of freedom in the US or a symptom of eroding freedom.
It was an overzealous secret service agent, not an attack on your freedom of speech. I am sure he isn't the first or last "security" type person who has overstepped their bounds. The worst thing about this isn't that some guy was arrested for no reason, the worst thing is that the Secret service agent who should be very highly trained was so out of line.
What is tragic is your joy at jumping to conclusions and pointing your finger at "solid evidence" that we are losing our freedom of speech, but fail to see how much more openly acceptable it is to mock the Govt on TV, radio, internet whatever medium you can think of then ever before.
Submitted by firefly (user info) at 2006-10-12 15:49:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by livEvil (user info) at 2006-10-12 15:44:11 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by marginwalker (user info) at 2006-10-12 15:13:47 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Well stated, Mr. Berg.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2006-10-12 14:45:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:07:59 (#)
Ranking: 2
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"And THAT is what's wrong with this country."
What was your literal message?
"This country" implies that it is a US phenomenon.
Do you think that in no other western country that someone might say something to a public official (especially when they are by themselves), and have security overeact?
Yes "THAT" is a fucked up thing to happen. But at the end of the day he only had half a day wasted and it isn't like he can't talk about, it isn't like he can't sue (and will make a ton of money). In no way is it an ideal situation, or excusable but he wasn't shot, he didn't spend the night in jail and the fact that charges were dropped and he can make a public case about shows our system isn't that messed up.
"THAT" isn't part of some massive restriction on our rights. "THAT" isn't isn't anywhere near what is wrong with our country. "THAT" is something only an idiot would point to and say it "is what's wrong with this country". "THAT" was an overzealous agent who has probably ruined his career.
I think it is fucked up, I think people should get upset but it is stupid to sit back and point and "wow we are so messed up".
"Do you think that in no other western country that someone might say something to a public official (especially when they are by themselves), and have security overeact?"
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I hate to say it but Indoninja is absolutely right.
To simplistically state "And THAT is what's wrong with this country" doesn't even come close to accurately depicting what is wrong with the United States of America. That particular list is gigantic and impossible to even comprehend. Massive failures on every level of American society exist and are aggressively ignored every single day. Discussion of these failures is met with distain and oftentimes righteous indignation. "HOW DARE YOU SAY THAT?" (Even if it's true.) This unwillingness for 'us' to talk inevitably leads to a significant lack of accountability which then enables organized manipulative assholes (read: folks like Bushco.) to continually "work the system" and perpetuate the withering cycle of greed and stupidity. The notion of "things aren't THAT bad" is pervasive and easy to spread... because quite frankly things CAN always get worse.
And are things worse or in the same shit state in other countries in the world?
Of course - humanity is failing on all sorts of levels. But when does that failure become something that 'we' start actually caring about and not a convenient excuse for our apathy? These excuses only fuel an ever-willing and ever-growing population who literally feeds on distraction and flaunts their own willful ignorance. If it doesn't directly affect someone - then they simply do not give a shit.
And why would we even WANT to give a shit? When do we start paying a little more attention?
When we start seeing people put in jail?
Perhaps it would have been more fair for the good Captain to say "And THAT is (yet another thing t)hat's wrong with this country"... but then Indo wouldn't have got his semantic panties in a bunch.
Oh, and I am also astounded that Indoninja actually justifies the steady decline of the American standard for freedom and liberty by heralding the fact that this guy can now sue.
That is fucking fantastic. (read: tragic.)
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 14:01:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:16:38 (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:13:59 (#)
Ranking: 2
Touche.
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Plus I like to argue.
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Doesn't everyone? Where's ETS in all this??
Submitted by IntangibleHands (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:53:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
By Matthew Rothschild ??!?!?!
Don't you know that the Rothschild Lineage is heir to the Illuminati throne?!
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:21:54 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
that you do.
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:21:15 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:16:38 (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:13:59 (#)
Ranking: 2
Touche.
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Plus I like to argue.
===========================
Well, I guess that is what makes Uber so entertaining, right? :)
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:16:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:13:59 (#)
Ranking: 2
Touche.
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Plus I like to argue.
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:13:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Touche.
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 13:07:59 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:50:34 (#)
Ranking: 2
Indo - what crawled up your butt? Wasn't jumping on any bandwagon, I just think it's "reprehensible" that a US citizen was unable to freely voice a non-threatening opinion to a government official without getting cuffed and accused of something he didn't do.
But apparently you like to read much more into my comments than the literal message.
---------------------------
"And THAT is what's wrong with this country."
What was your literal message?
"This country" implies that it is a US penomenon. Do you think that in no other western country that someone might say something to a public official (especially when they are by themselves), and have security overeact?
Yes "THAT" is a fucked up thing to happen. But at the end of the day he only had half a day wasted and it isn't like he can't talk about, it isn't like he can't sue (and will make a ton of money). In no way is it an ideal situation, or excusable but he wasn't shot, he didn't spend the night in jail and the fact that charges were dropped and he can make a public case about shows our system isn't that messed up.
"THAT" isn't part of some massive restriction on our rights. "THAT" isn't isn't anywhere near what is wrong with our country. "THAT" is something only an idiot would point to and say it "is what's wrong with this country". "THAT" was an overzealous agent who has probably ruined his career.
I think it is fucked up, I think people should get upset but it is stupid to sit back and point and "wow we are so messed up".
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:50:34 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:06:02 (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:59:52 (#)
Ranking: 2
And THAT is what's wrong with this country.
-----------------
THAT is why you are whiny little cunt.
The secret service fucked up.
Should he be punished, yes.
Should this guy have a law suit and recieve an apology or money or something, yes.
Does this mean we have no Freedom of Speech, or that we are living in a Nazi state, no.
================================================
Indo - what crawled up your butt? Wasn't jumping on any bandwagon, I just think it's "reprehensible" that a US citizen was unable to freely voice a non-threatening opinion to a government official without getting cuffed and accused of something he didn't do.
But apparently you like to read much more into my comments than the literal message.
Submitted by bob (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:37:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by professorfuckface (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:37:32 (#)
Ranking: 0
No, Cheney is excerising his power. He is the winner. You are all losers. You don't have his kind of money or power, so too fucking bad, you are his and anyone else's bitch who is higher than you on the food chain. Don't like it? Leave society.
___________
Read some Locke, whose notions pretty much formed the basis for this country, and then get back to me.
This was pathetic.
What he did doesnt even classify as assault or anything of the like.
So sad.
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:23:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:07:22 (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:58:39 (#)
Ranking: 2
i still can't believe he signed with a part against gay marriage when his daughter's a lesbian.
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Would you want a butch hairy dyke as an in law?
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why not, he already has one for a daughter.
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:19:44 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:06:02 (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:59:52 (#)
Ranking: 2
And THAT is what's wrong with this country.
-----------------
THAT is why you are whiny little cunt.
The secret service fucked up.
Should he be punished, yes.
Should this guy have a law suit and recieve an apology or money or something, yes.
Does this mean we have no Freedom of Speech, or that we are living in a Nazi state, no.
If our country was so fucked up he wouldn't be allowed to sue.
But go ahead and jump on ths stupid fucking ETS band wagon, go watch a movie about the army training with US volounteers and conclude that they are getting ready to declare martial law. A secret service member overstepped his bounds so it is the end of the US.
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THAT is why you don't get invited to parties, crankypants.
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:07:22 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:58:39 (#)
Ranking: 2
i still can't believe he signed with a part against gay marriage when his daughter's a lesbian.
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Would you want a butch hairy dyke as an in law?
Submitted by indoninja (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:06:02 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:59:52 (#)
Ranking: 2
And THAT is what's wrong with this country.
-----------------
THAT is why you are whiny little cunt.
The secret service fucked up.
Should he be punished, yes.
Should this guy have a law suit and recieve an apology or money or something, yes.
Does this mean we have no Freedom of Speech, or that we are living in a Nazi state, no.
If our country was so fucked up he wouldn't be allowed to sue.
But go ahead and jump on ths stupid fucking ETS band wagon, go watch a movie about the army training with US volounteers and conclude that they are getting ready to declare martial law. A secret service member overstepped his bounds so it is the end of the US.
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:05:22 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Ha...goddamnit.
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:04:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
"Will Bottom For Food" sign holder below.
Submitted by Hypatia86 (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:04:45 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
haha, Dick sucks Cock.
Submitted by Method (user info) at 2006-10-12 12:02:46 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I hope this guy sues and gets a huge award, but he'll probably be found dead in his garage with the car running, like Orgasmafag said
Submitted by CaptainThorns (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:59:52 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
And THAT is what's wrong with this country.
Submitted by Method (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:59:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I'd love to fight a secret service guy one on one
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:58:39 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
i still can't believe he signed with a part against gay marriage when his daughter's a lesbian.
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:54:36 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:53:41 (#)
Ranking: 2
So basically we'll find him dead from a successful "suicide attempt" soon. Great.
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Would not surprise me.
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:53:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
So basically we'll find him dead from a successful "suicide attempt" soon. Great.
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:52:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:50:25 (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:47:53 (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:38:57 (#)
Ranking: 2
Well the bacteria in his mouth was likely carried on the wind and forced against Cheney's face. That's bioterrorism right there. We can't allow such violence in this nation. WHO KNOWS WHAT LAST HE ATE?!
For shame.
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Had not thought of that, damn funny!
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It won't be funny when he's convicted of these charges because of "secret evidence."
Or - EVEN WORSE - "double secret probation evidence."
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If he does that will be even scarier as the charges have already been dropped by the local DA and he's now filing suit against the SS.
Submitted by freebie (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:51:53 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Its nice to see Dick showing some restarint. Dont forget this guy is so fucking badass he shoots his friends in the face.
The guy should count himself lucky he wasnt drawn and quartered, disemboweld and given a major wedgie for dissing the VP
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:51:20 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by DCWoody (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:48:44 (#)
Ranking: 1
ETS, take note, this is how and what you should be posting.
PS: democrat or republican doesn't matter much, you guys have two party politics, it will always end up damn near the same no matter who you vote for, I think you best hope is to get your individual state to declare independance.
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Even though it's said in my state we eat our young, we actually can.
Texas
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:50:25 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:47:53 (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:38:57 (#)
Ranking: 2
Well the bacteria in his mouth was likely carried on the wind and forced against Cheney's face. That's bioterrorism right there. We can't allow such violence in this nation. WHO KNOWS WHAT LAST HE ATE?!
For shame.
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Had not thought of that, damn funny!
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It won't be funny when he's convicted of these charges because of "secret evidence."
Or - EVEN WORSE - "double secret probation evidence."
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:50:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:44:32 (#)
Ranking: 2
i do hate that man.
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Notice the file name of the picture?
Submitted by DCWoody (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:48:44 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
ETS, take note, this is how and what you should be posting.
PS: democrat or republican doesn't matter much, you guys have two party politics, it will always end up damn near the same no matter who you vote for, I think you best hope is to get your individual state to declare independance.
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:47:53 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:38:57 (#)
Ranking: 2
Well the bacteria in his mouth was likely carried on the wind and forced against Cheney's face. That's bioterrorism right there. We can't allow such violence in this nation. WHO KNOWS WHAT LAST HE ATE?!
For shame.
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Had not thought of that, damn funny!
Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:47:12 EDT (#)
Ranking: 1
I'm wondering how much of this little tale is embellished.
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:44:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
i do hate that man.
Submitted by marginwalker (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:40:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
You know, part of me hopes the Democrats DO get in. But I think the bottom line is, in a two-party system, ideological "divides" are relatively insignificant.
Submitted by Orgasmatron (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:38:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Well the bacteria in his mouth was likely carried on the wind and forced against Cheney's face. That's bioterrorism right there. We can't allow such violence in this nation. WHO KNOWS WHAT LAST HE ATE?!
For shame.
Submitted by professorfuckface (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:37:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
No, Cheney is excerising his power. He is the winner. You are all losers. You don't have his kind of money or power, so too fucking bad, you are his and anyone else's bitch who is higher than you on the food chain. Don't like it? Leave society.
Submitted by Axolotl (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:35:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Disgraceful conduct. By the SS, that is.
Submitted by DrSeussman (user info) at 2006-10-12 11:34:55 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Things sure are going to hell in a hand basket. Any bets on whether or not we have a Democrat in the office next?