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STOP GAYING UP THE UBERBOARD! You can bitch about gun stuff all you want right here.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-06-19 16:46:11 EDT
Rating: 1.25 on 9 ratings (31 reviews) (Review this item) (V)

The image below is of my Home D primary weapon. It's a 'Saiga 12', which is a Russian-made Kalashnikov-based 12 gauge autoloading shotgun. It uses removable magazines (the one in the pic holds 10 rds). It's barrel has been shortened to 11 inches (legally, though the BATFE Form 1 process including a $200 Tax Stamp). It has a folding stock, which when folded gives the whole autoloading 12 gauge shotgun a length of about 24 inches (or 61 cm). It has a flashlight on it, which is there to illuminate where the 00 Buckshot is going to go if the room is dark when the gun is needed. It has a holographic sight for the same use in daylight. It's short so that I can turn around in a hallway with the stock open. It's got a decent capacity and swappable magazines so, if I need to use it, I don't have to reload as often and I can do so quickly if needed. It's autoloading so I can use it with one hand if necessary.

It looks aggressive enough that the California legislature has an apoplectic attack whenever they think of anything remotely like it, because it's supposed to. Recall your HGttG, on the subject of guns: "Make it totally clear that this gun has a right end and a wrong end. Make it totally clear to anyone standing at the wrong end that things are going badly for them. If that means sticking all sort of spikes and prongs and blackened bits all over it then so be it. This is not a gun for hanging over the fireplace or sticking in the umbrella stand, it is a gun for going out and making people miserable with." I don't go out with it (except to the back yard to keep in practice), but if you're in my house and threatening me or mine then the wrong end of this is what you get to see. If an intruder gets scared and runs away because the big scary gun is so big and scary, well then the intruder problem is solved.

If you live in a place that allows you to own such a thing and you care to do so and if you have some mechanical ability and some tools and if you don't have anything in your background that would prevent you from getting a $200 Tax Stamp for a Title II Weapon (and you probably don't), you can build one of these yourself, legally, for around $1700. If you have to pay someone to resize the gas port in the barrel (and you probably will), plan on around $2200. Everything else is bolt-on or drop-in.

For the record: I have not shot anyone with this gun. I do not plan to do so, I do not want to do so, and I actively hope that I don't ever need to. I own this gun for home defense. Not for any other reasons. Defense of the home and that is all.

If you like, discuss.


Review This Item




Submitted by skrapmetal at 2016-10-31 00:36:05 EDT (#)

All y'all who wanted to but didn't say "yes" to the previous question have utterly missed out on some damned fine feral sausage. Your loss.

There's a brick oven pizza food truck guy near me that will put my hunting proceeds on a pizza if I trade him some. I did this, and he made me three pizzas with this hogsausage on olive oil and barbeque sauce with parm, mozz, basil, oregano, thyme, garlic, more garlic, even more garlic, salt, and onion. It. Was. Stupidgood.

Get over yourself and go kill something meaty and then eat it. You won't regret it.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2016-10-26 20:23:32 EDT (#)

Well I was out at a friend's 500-acre place near Ocala scouting for deer this morning and by chance I had my RPR 308 in the truck. Didn't a big hog show up right at the tree line about 500m away! It was rooting around at the edge of the woods so I set up prone in the bed of my truck and positioned the bipod and monopod for a lobshot. 500m is about the limit for 308, y'know. Not too much wind and cool enough that the thermals were ignorable. The scope had been tested on at 100 & 300m with my Saker 7.62 so I twisted that doodad onto the end of the barrel. Earmuffs are for those who won't address the problem directly. I put the big tusker's shoulder behind the 3rd dot down and squeeeeeezed that awesome Timney trigger I'd installed only yesterday. A sound like a air framing hammer breaking a large stick was heard, and... piff! Dead on - the pig took one step and dropped. Took down the rig, 4WD across the field, and sure as shit there was a very dead hog laying there awaiting my knife. In and out right in front of the shoulder, almost completely severing the spine. Damned if that RPR isn't an awesome piece of machinery. We gutted and carved it up right there, and split the take since it was his property - we got about 35lbs of meat apiece. Loaded up my freezer when I got home, and I'm gonna make feral hog sausage this weekend... WHO WANTS SOME?!

Submitted by Linus at 2015-09-16 23:45:45 EDT (#)
Rating: 1

Cool, doubt you can have one in Cali tho. The only thing that really interests me about guns is marksmanship.

As far as the social issue goes, I'm not sure you should be able to have one in certain contexts where you're likely to kill someone by mistake. Obviously being in an apartment block vs house vs farmhouse has different implications. Too tired to really flesh that out right now though, perhaps later.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-09-08 10:21:58 EDT (#)

If you are or are not bothered by the mere existence of guns, you can say so here.

I am not bothered by the mere existence of guns.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-09-07 08:45:19 EDT (#)

It's for that very reason, Silvr, that I keep my cutting torch locked safely in an armored tool chest in the sub-basement of my garage surrounded by a moat of acid, flying monkeys carrying large rocks, and time shift field set to 35 minutes in the past. Statistics can be made to clearly show that people who keep cutting torches in their home are more likely to end up with torch cutting being done by criminals who break in than they are to braze up a nice cage for the intruder once they're inside. If you have a cutting torch, lock it the hell up and never never never ever get it out for any reason whatsoever. In fact, we really need to ban all cutting torches because someone might maybe possibly maybe misuse one! DO IT FADA CHIDRIN!

Submitted by Anglophile at 2015-09-07 04:34:03 EDT (#)
Rating: 2

5.56x45 = seriously pregnant 22 caliber. Dirty Harry would giggle.

Submitted by SilvrWolf at 2015-09-06 22:59:28 EDT (#)

OMG, Skrap! Those rounds are responsible for the deaths of millions of children every day! How could you lock them safely away like that? What if some neighborhood kid gets around your defenses, obtains a cutting torch and gains access to your ammo locker?

You should be ashamed! Won't anyone think of the chirrens anymo'?

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-09-06 22:09:24 EDT (#)

Oh, and for the psychotically obsessive gun-fearing guy: my neighbor and I reloaded 2100 rds of 5.56x45 ammo today, tested 100 of them in the 33m range in my yard to make sure they were safe to use, decided they were, each put half of the remainder in our respective ammo lockers for future use, and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it. 'ave a noice dai.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-09-03 09:03:03 EDT (#)

Velocity trigger update: the thing comes with threaded holes in the housing that you use to install first locking screws that press against the receiver and then set screws to hold the locking screws in place. This pushes the trigger housing up against the FCG pins and makes the trigger very solidly attached to the receiver.

If you were to fail to tighten, or say, even remove the locking screws during your install so the trigger 'floats' on the FCG pins, however, then the trigger fits a bit loose in the receiver. If you then, oh, I dunno, maybe don't bury the stock against your shoulder real hard, and if you pull the trigger back lightly, you can experience what some shooters call a problem but what others call a feature in that it can be made to 'bump-fire' and you can dump an entire 30rd mag in about 3 seconds. Fair warning.

For the record, I'm not setting any of my ARs up this way. I consider it dangerous to have rattling parts in my weapons, and if I wanted a machine gun I'd go about getting a real one legally.

Also: turns out that similar design triggers (Timney, etc.) all do the same thing. For $135 shipped you can be this guy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKpcqMBk4lo

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-08-17 19:03:17 EDT (#)

The Velocity AR platform trigger is a really fine piece of American engineering from Tom Vehr, the guy who developed the famous Timney drop-in trigger for AR. 3 lb trigger pull and 2 mm reset - perfect for your DM AR build. Available in 4lb or 4.5lb pull for your PR or SBR build. Skrapmetal tested, Skrapmetal approved.


$135 at http://www.gotammollc.com/VELOCITY-AR15-AR10-3LB-DROP-IN-TRIGGER-p/velo1.htm

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-08-14 19:30:08 EDT (#)

The ALG AKT is a really fine piece of American engineering from a subgroup of Geissele Automatics. $49 shipped and it makes my cheesy AMD AK run like a pretty damn accurate and reliable hole-punching machine. Safety on - trigger Does. Not. Move. Safety off - single stage 3 lb pull, 4.5mm reset. Skrapmetal tested, Skrapmetal approved.


Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-08-05 13:30:15 EDT (#)

Submitted by Cakes at 2015-07-18 23:28:50 EDT (#)
Rating: -1

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-07-14 08:06:20 EDT (#)

Well the .300AAC Blackout upper did well at the range out to 100m so I think I'll keep it. Can't see myself using it much past 50m anyway. Got it dialed in with a holo sight I had on the shelf. That it uses the same mags/lower as 5.56x45/.223 is convenient, but also a potential problem. Had to spray paint a couple 30rd mags and the .300AAC upper receiver to designate them as non-5.56.

Submitted by JonnyX at 2015-07-13 10:58:11 EDT (#)
Rating: 2

Submitted by SilvrWolf at 2015-07-10 09:50:00 EDT (#)


I've been hog hunting only once. My friends invited me to Georgia. I took my Springfield 1884 .45-70 and a heavily-modded SKS carbine. I was mercilessly ridiculed for my antique trap-door rifle. We glassed a decent-sized sow moving through some scrub about 100 meters away. I dropped in a hand-load with a Cor-Bon JHP bullet, took a prone position, aimed and sent the projectile. Impact was 1 inch behind and 1 inch below the right ear, after splitting a water oak sapling in two. Like flipping a switch, the hog hit the ground and its head nearly rolled off. My friends no longer make fun of my Springfield.

To be fair, it is 54 inches long and isn't the most practical of guns to hunt scrub and brush, but the results are indisputable. They want me to come down and hunt this year, too. I might take my Rossi Puma .357 this time. It's pulling 2650 fps on the current loading. Pushing a SWC bullet, it's like throwing sledgehammers through the woods. It should be fun, going from what is essentially a 19th century sniper rifle to a reproduction of a 19th century saddle ring carbine.

And that's our daily dose of gun porn...

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-07-08 10:31:09 EDT (#)

Thanks, Silvr. Agree abut the HK91 once you're up in the high-power realm. I had an AR-10 (7.62x51) back in the day, and I didn't care for it much. I have a Ruger Gunsite Scout for that purpose today, and it's much better suited. They even make .50BMG uppers for the AR platform, but that's putting too much trust in the little bits of aluminum around those two 1/4 inch pins that hold all that power together for me.

That said, I do like hunting feral hogs and I hear the .300 AAC Blackout makes a really nice round for that. So, I'll prolly build the upper for SBR and take it in the woods some weekend. If it works, cool, and if not, it'll sell. It won't get used much so I won't invest in dies, just stock some factory ammo for hunting if it does stay in the safe.

Submitted by SilvrWolf at 2015-07-08 08:52:28 EDT (#)

I've never been a fan of 7.62 anything in an AR. It never felt comfortable to me to shoot them in the larger calibers. The HK91 platform is much better suited for anything in the .30 class, imo, but I'm heavily biased. I'll throw my HK up against an AR rig, any day. Granted, there isn't nearly as much of a modder's market in HK land. I have shot the Blackout round, though, and can say that it's pretty impressive, but still feel like it falls well short of the WSM. My dream rig would be to mod an HK for the WSM round (something that's actually not that hard to do).

Bottom line, the more chamberings you have, the more cartridges, dies and brass you have. You already know this. Except for my antiques, I've pared my calibers down to pretty much .22 and .30 class projectiles, and have gotten rid of all of my wildcats.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-07-07 18:36:21 EDT (#)

Anybody have experience with ARs in .300 Blackout? Traded some assembly labor for a nice 14" SS .300 barrel/gas block/gas tube/muzzle device, and I'm debating whether to build an upper or sell the stuff. Not sure I want to stock *yet another* caliber of ammo. Thoughts?

Submitted by JonnyX at 2015-06-22 11:53:46 EDT (#)
Rating: 2

AJ sighting below!

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-06-21 13:56:06 EDT (#)

AJ - here's an easy way to understand the 'guns as deterrent' concept. Assuming you live somewhere where owning a gun in your home is legal, would you post a sign on your front door saying clearly that you do not have a gun inside? If not, then you are already using guns as a deterrent since you are allowing potential burgers/robbers/etc to believe you may have a gun for home d. With such a sign in place, could you trust that intruders in your home would simply leave if they realized you were in the house?

I don't keep that shotgun handy to protect my stuff (though, where I live, I could use it for that). I have an alarm system, cameras, and insurance . The weapons are to help me protect myself and my family from those who would do us harm.

Submitted by AJ at 2015-06-21 10:57:29 EDT (#)
Rating: 0

I am always perplexed at anyone feeling the need for a gun in their home. Maybe it's because I'm not really beholden to any of my material items. Maybe it's because the thought of shooting someone sickens me because I've borne witness to my brother's paralysis from a handgun accident for over twenty years. Maybe it's because I can't conceive of any possible reason I would need to be in a scenario that was them or me - I'm not in an 80s action movie.

I just don't get the whole, "gun as a deterrent" mentality. Someone breaking into your house won't know you have a gun until it's too late for them anyway - so the situation is just escalated that much further.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-06-21 09:57:27 EDT (#)

Doodles: This does in fact stay unlocked, loaded and, though hidden, within easy reach (with the safety on). I don't have kids and MLW has her own Home D weapon. Caveat: when we have welcome guests of any kind, every gun is secured from those guests. Safety first.

Zoidberg: While your boyfriend my accessorize with guns, most gun owners, myself included, do not. I explained my reasons for choosing this particular device for the purpose in the post. Note that sexual orientation is nowhere in there. Why must you impose lifestyle choices that you imagine others make as the overriding factor in what is really as straightforward a decision as choosing a roofing hammer over a framing hammer when preparing to work on roof shingles?

Submitted by Doodles at 2015-06-21 08:38:53 EDT (#)
Rating: 2

I think you're a fairly reasonable person, so I imagine you don't keep that unlocked, loaded, and with the safety off. My sole issue with guns is mind numbingly stupid people who leave their guns loaded and sitting out, and are then shocked hen their kids accidentally shoot each other/themselves.

Oh and i loathe those "zombie guns". A gun is a tool. It isn't a toy. It demands respect, and if you impulse buy a gun because it's "totally going to save you from all those zombies man, lol" I hate you.

Submitted by Zoidberg at 2015-06-20 21:40:33 EDT (#)

That's adorable. I bought my boyfriend one of these. His exact words were, "I want a gun, but not one that will make people think I'm straight."

Submitted by tenofspades at 2015-06-20 17:40:08 EDT (#)
Rating: 2

if the police have guns, and the criminals have guns, then we need guns, too.

Submitted by Mr T pities jonnytexmex the old child toucher at 2015-06-20 05:46:09 EDT (#)


Submitted by BLITZKREIG_BOB at 2015-06-19 20:31:58 EDT (#)
Rating: 2

That's pretty sweet.

I keep a Judge loaded with all birdshot (don't want slugs to go through the walls into the kids' rooms, if shit hits the proverbial fan) strapped to the back of my headboard for the same purpose.

Submitted by SilvrWolf at 2015-06-19 19:16:49 EDT (#)

"100% hygiene is impossible. You should still wash your hands."

This one was my favorite. They weren't saying that guns should only go to the licensed and capable; they're arguing that they should be banned outright (oh, except shotguns and powder-actuated tools, of course). To make their conflating analogy even remotely apt, it should've been phrased: "100% hygiene is impossible. You should still chop off your hands."

I'm with 'em, though. Off with everyone's hands! Do it for the hygiene. Won't someone PLEASE think of the hygiene?

Submitted by SilvrWolf at 2015-06-19 19:10:01 EDT (#)

My home defense weapon is a Winchester Defender Marine Stainless, pistol grip rear, pistol grip slide. Fun weapon and very reliable. The rest of my guns stay in a vault.

I do like how the anti-gunner on the uberboard ultimately degraded into little more than name-calling and even made conflations of their own after lamenting the conflations of the pro-gunner. Reasonable debate be damned, huh? Just label your opponent in an intentionally derogatory manner and repeat whenever you don't have a point. But make sure you tell your opponent to stay on topic first.

Submitted by skrapmetal at 2015-06-19 17:16:58 EDT (#)

While it's better to have a half-empty mag when the fight's over than to run out beforehand, it's better still to not have the fight in the first place.

That's weird. It's like something out of that twilighty show about
that zone.

-- Homer Simpson
Treehouse of Horror VI